Stealth inflation

[jtr1962]

It seems economists have found a new form of inflation-stealth inflation. Basically, what this amounts to is all sorts of new fees and charges being added to bills but not counted in the CPI. In addition to the charges mentioned, you also have credit card companies not crediting payments received before the due date so they can collect late fees. This happened to me and my brother a few times already. Sure, they'll take the fees off if you call(because they know damned well it's their fault), but many people won't spend the time on hold to fight these fees.

 

[timwhit]

Do you pay your CC bills online or through snail-mail? Never had a problem paying online, yet.

 

[jtr1962]

My brother pays by mail, I pay online. For the longest time I would pay a few days before the due date, and my account was generally credited the next business day after I paid. Last year, I ran into problems. For a few months in a row, the payment wasn't credited until a week to ten days after I did it online. I never got a straight answer as to exactly what they were doing differently, but now I have to make sure to pay at least 10 days ahead of time. I still don't get it. I don't see why an electronic transfers shouldn't take place either the same or next business day. In my opinion it's a scam to collect late fees. The third time it happened they were giving me problems when I asked to have the fees removed. Fortunately I kept a printout of the transaction numbers for the online payment so they couldn't say the payment was made late. However, they still refused to remove the late fees, and insisted I should have paid at least one week early. I told them it wasn't my problem if someone sat on the payment for a week, and that I would cancel my account if they refused to take the fees off. They finally relented. Few people would have been as persistent as I was.

 

[Howell]

They may have stopped allowing direct electronic transfers to which your bank would respond by writing a physical check. Which still shouldn't take 10 days. Of course disallowing electronic transfers would only be for the late fees.

 

[CityK]

credit card companies not crediting payments received before the due date so they can collect late fees.

OMG jtr, I almost posted a big rant about this two weeks ago. I was quite livid about the whole affair - I was going to entitle it "when is a due date not a due date...when you dealing with credit card issuing banks".

I always pay online, on the due date. Never had a problem before. Then on my past statement for one of my cards I got a late fee charge. On my statement it clearly states the transaction date, but they also list a posting date too (the day they say they update the account).

I called up and, kindly bringing this matter to their attention, asked for the erroneous charge to be removed accordingly. A big run around arguement ensued with three CSRs/bank drones :evil:. The drone's arguments were that if your going to pay online make sure you do it a couple of days in advance because it takes time to clear and update the accounts.

I said bullshit - the money is removed instanteously from my bank account (at another institution) and my bank account records reflect this (i.e transaction date), as does my credit card companies statement itself (i.e reflected in the transaction date)!. I'm no longer in possesion of that money. Its certainly not floating around in cyberspace. So obviously someone is making interest off of it, and it ain't me. Now I'm not up on ususry laws but it kind of smacks me that this practice is probably illegal if put to the test. Second, if I had paid by mailing in a cheque, and had the letter post marked the due date or prior, then the law developed around the Postal Rule clearly affirms me of having fulfilled my contractual duty.

Anyways, after a long hassle, the third guy (or his supervisor allowed him, as he kept putting me on extended hold) tells me that he will "waive" the late payment charge as one time courtosey to the customer, and proceeds to inform me that I've been warned to make online payments earlier then the due date or else I would be charged in the future (note: these conversations are recorded). After the fifteen minutes of this crap, I was pretty much sick of talking with them on the phone and just wanted to get off the line, and so I said thank you and acknowledged that I had understood the verbal caution about paying "on time".

After I hung up I thought to myself - "hey wait a minute, what just transpired there?" Its all pretty simple actually. They had strung me along until I was feedup and then they completley flipped the entire situation around to their advantage. I was made to end up thanking them for extending me a "courtesy" and for "waiving" the charge brought about by my delinquent behaviour of not paying on time.

First off, I didn't need to ask for them to waive it - they owed me the duty to REMOVE the erronous charge.

Second off, I'm not in the least bit thankful for there supposed "courtesy" - there was none to begin with: they owed me a duty to REMOVE the erronous charge, and thus, there was nothing about this matter for them to "waive". In fact, the whole pretense that the charge was "waived" as a one time courtesy makes me want to be sick. Having said that, I'm certainly not in the least bit thankful for the fifteen minutes of my life they managed to waste in order to resolve this manner.

Third, the matter was not resolved to my liking - sure the charge was "waived", but that certainly wasn't the point about it to begin with!. Nor am I at all certain as to the consequences of having provided my "thank you" and "acknowledgement" to some statement read to me during a conversation that was being recorded all along - the very same conversation, which near its end, I would probably have said/agreed to pretty much anything just to get it over and done with. Once again, they owed me the duty to REMOVE that erroneous charge. Yet, the only way I could get it removed was to subject myself through a scolding and warning, and to thank them for their supposed graciousness! How fucked up is that.

 

[jtr1962]

Anyways, after a long hassle, the third guy (or his supervisor allowed him, as he kept putting me on extended hold) tells me that he will "waive" the late payment charge as one time courtosey to the customer, and proceeds to inform me that I've been warned to make online payments earlier then the due date or else I would be charged in the future (note: these conversations are recorded

This sounds almost identical to what happened to me, including the BS about waiving the fee being a "one-time courtesy". If nothing else, the bank should have provided some warning that online payments would take longer than usual after whatever changes they made. I wouldn't be surprised if the changes that caused the problem involved oursourcing the credit card billing jobs to India or China. I still think it's asinine that I have to lose ten days interest each month because of these changes. Sadly, I didn't record the calls like you did.

Another thing annoying me about banks is the cheap interest they're paying even though they're still charging the same high interest on outstanding credit card balances. Of course, I pay in full every month but many don't. They should either reduce the rates they charge or give me more. I'm getting more annoyed at banks each day. :x

 

[Handruin]

Another thing annoying me about banks is the cheap interest they're paying even though they're still charging the same high interest on outstanding credit card balances. Of course, I pay in full every month but many don't. They should either reduce the rates they charge or give me more. I'm getting more annoyed at banks each day. :x

Call and boldly ask them to lower the rate. (I know you shouldn't have to, but it can't hurt to ask) I did, and they dropped mine as a fixed rate from 14% to 9%. Like you, I don't carry a balance either and I pay in full.

They asked me why I wanted to lower my rate and if I had a big purchase coming up. I told them I see offers of lower interests all the time and I'm not married to your CC and that I have no purchases coming up. They reduced my fixed rate after a few minutes of talking with them.

I'm going to call after xmas and have them lower it again or I may find a new CC. I'm trying to slowly work them down to a very low fixed rate. This way if I ever do have an emergency and need to carry a large balance, at least I've saved a few $$ by trying to lower the rate. (not that 9% is fantastic, but better than average)

On the savings side, I'm with you jtr. Banks annoy me more and more every day. Every time I look at my bank savings statement, the interest rate gets lower and lower...and I'm not with a mega-super big bank. (maybe I should be)

Another thing with CC companies is how they send those stupid blank checks. It annoys me that I have to call each of my CC companies and request them to stop sending every month. I also had to request from my own CC company that they STOP callling me.

I have to admit that now I haven't had a marketing call for a long time. This may be due to the Do-not-call list, but either way, I'm happy.

 

[CityK]

Sadly, I didn't record the calls like you did.

No no. I wasn't the one recording - its the bank. They record these conversations to protect their asses.

My point was that I had just verbally said thank you and acknowledged that I understood their "warning". Suppose in the future some dispute arises between them and me. What rights or position of defense have I some what unwittingly forsaken by having replied to them like I did (just to get off the phone) during a conversation that all along was being recorded.

The whole situation was just flipped. Instead of the bank apologizing to me for placing an erroneous charge on my statement, I end up being made out to thank them for graciously waiving what the charge, and also also thank them for tolerance of my behaviour. And on top of that I'm given a warning to not do it again (Do what again? I did nothing wrong in the first place!!!).

The whole affair seemed scripted and stank of them trying to bring legitimacy to their actions.

 

[timwhit]

Not to be nosey or anything, but what cards have you guys had problems with in the past. I carry a CapitalOne Visa and an American Express Blue and have had no problems with either one.

It would be nice to know which banks to avoid in the future.

 

[jtr1962]

Not to be nosey or anything, but what cards have you guys had problems with in the past. I carry a CapitalOne Visa and an American Express Blue and have had no problems with either one.

It would be nice to know which banks to avoid in the future.

Chase Mastercard and Chase Visa. The Mastercard gave me problems but I'm sure the Visa would have as well(except I never use it). Chase sucks but sadly there aren't many alternatives. Citibank is even worse.

 

[Howell]

CityK, Once you have seen the correction clear call them back and thank them for clearing up that incident and then tell them that you would now like to talk about the general practice.

I think that would cover you. The implication is that if you were willing to call back dissatisfied with the overall practice then what you were agreeing to the first time was "Yes, I'd like to have my money back."

I was mistaken about the question when I posted before. I now understand that you guys are talking about going to the CC website and asking them to withdraw X amount from you bank account.

I have stopped this practice altogether. I don't want any company to have enough information that they can withdraw from my account "accidently". I always "push" my payments, rather than "pull".

 

[timwhit]

My mom uses a Chase Mastercard, and I don't think she has had any problems with it.

There are so many alternatives out there that I could switch from bank to bank every year for the rest of my life, which is a good reason for a CC company to want to keep its customers around. Even if you always pay on time they still make a lot of profits from having you as a customer.

 

[jtr1962]

On the savings side, I'm with you jtr. Banks annoy me more and more every day. Every time I look at my bank savings statement, the interest rate gets lower and lower...and I'm not with a mega-super big bank. (maybe I should be)

Another thing with CC companies is how they send those stupid blank checks. It annoys me that I have to call each of my CC companies and request them to stop sending every month. I also had to request from my own CC company that they STOP callling me.

Thanks for mentioning another of my pet peeves-those asinine blank checks. I called and had them stopped ages ago. I recently started getting them occasionally with my CC statement rather than in a separate envelope. I can't believe people actually use those things. You pay a fee up front, and then what amounts to usureous(spelling?) interest on the unpaid balance.

I did pull a nice one with the interest once. They had forgotten to link all my accounts after I told them to. When I finally corrected the situation it turned out that I had a high enough balance to earn the premium rate going back quite a ways. Of course, they didn't want to make any adjustments until I threatened to switch banks. It was nice seeing an interest credit of something like $1600 two weeks later. I'm thinking if it's ever possible to prove they've had an unfairly low rate I might get an adjustment going back to the mid-1990s(which is when rates started getting low). The account paid 8.5% when I opened it in 1989. Now it's 1.07%. That's the select premium rate! I dread to think what the regular rate is. As soon as I feel more comfortable with mutual funds I'm investing the bulk of it there.

 

[jtr1962]

I was mistaken about the question when I posted before. I now understand that you guys are talking about going to the CC website and asking them to withdraw X amount from you bank account.

I don't know about CityK, but what I do each month is transfer money at Chase online for my bills from my checking to savings account. After that I pay my CC bill online at the same site(and same session). They debit my checking account immediately but there is a delay before the amount gets credited to my CC. I have complete control over when and how much is paid, at least up until the point the payment goes to my CC. After that, it is anyone's guess when the payment is deducted from my charge card balance. I don't believe in automatic bill paying.

 

[jtr1962]

I don't know about CityK, but what I do each month is transfer money at Chase online for my bills from my checking to savings account.

That should be savings to checking account, not the other way around.

 

[its.fubar]

I don't know what you guy`s are complaining about it is called capitalism, the more money you have in a bank the better service you get the less money you have the poorer service you will receive it is all a matter of mathematics somebody has to pay for the service the rich receive or put another way everybody cannot expect to receive equal service Because there is not enough to go around,so continue to expect to be ripped off every time that you have any contact with any bank or republican conservative.

 

[Fushigi]

CitiBank is so far the one credit card company I refuse to do business with. I had been a long-time cardmember and closed my account as I had migrated to lower-interest, no annual fee cards. About 8 months later, I receive a bill with a charge on it for a magazine subscription renewal. Citibank had opened my closed account and posted a charge to it. Absolutely unacceptable. While I got the charge cancelled and the account re-closed, they never could explain how it happened in the first place. I wholeheartedly encourage any and everyone to not do business with Citibank.

My other cards I've never had any real problems with.

I pay virtually all bills by check and don't bother with online bill paying as I've not seen any benefit to it. The only exceptions are a couple of bills like my cel phone I link to a credit card for the bonus points.

Other companies/stores I refuse to do business with:
- AT&T
- Circuit City
- Chili's restaraunts
- McDonalds restaraunts

 

[Howell]

You are doing it the same way I am Joe. Except I'm using AMEX.

I recently called one of my CC companies to have the interest rate lowered. I usually pay off the balance of this card every month and so not worry about the rate but I haven't for a couple.

Anyway I called and the customer service person said that the computer said she could not lower it. I have been with this company for 1.5 years and the rate is now like 21%.

She was nice. I asked her if the company wanted me to remain their customer. She said she didn't know. She said she asked her boss once why some people get to lower their rate and others don't. Many factors. I asked again if their company wanted to keep me as a customer. She said probably not and asked me if I wanted to close it.

Tim, one thing to keep in mind is that when you apply for any credit your credit report registers a "hit". Too many hits can look bad to someone who reviews it.

 

[Howell]

I have eventually been able to consolodate all my credit card debts onto one card with a 2.9% rate for the life of the debt and no annual fee. I was even able to get the limit raised to accomodate. Execept for that and this stupid card I'm getting ready to cancel, I'm off the plastic.

 

[timwhit]

Tim, one thing to keep in mind is that when you apply for any credit your credit report registers a "hit". Too many hits can look bad to someone who reviews it.

I wasn't saying that I was going to do this, just that it is an option. If my CC companies start to screw me over then I will get a new card. Hasn't happened over the last couple of years, so I don't think it is that big of deal.

 

[Mercutio]

My personal accounts are BankOne. BankOne is a viscious, evil institution that introduced the "Pay $3 to talk to a bank teller" fee about five years ago.

That's OK. I can do even the most complex personal transactions at an ATM. I've never even talked to a teller there. Almost every Walgreens in Illinois and Indiana has an ATM, so I'm never THAT far from my money. I do absolutely all my transactions with a debit card. I kept my accounting for my personal account for several years; they haven't made a mistake yet, so now I'm satisfied with looking at my statements on line. Saves me hassle.

My personal savings account usually has > $10,000 in it, for which I earn a whopping 1% annual interest. Like jtr, I think I'm already in the highest interest category. I'd say I'm getting screwed, but honestly, I don't care all that much. 1% is so close to nothing at all, why bother?

Citi is evil beyond compare. I had a card there for years, never carried a balance from month to month. I ended up having to make a minor purchase with my Citi Mastercard - something like $8, because the store I was at didn't take Visa and I don't carry cash. I didn't pay the bill for two months - who wants to write a check for $8? I went to use the card again, and Citi apparently had a "destroy Merc's card" order out, 'cause the guy at the restaurant cut it up on the spot.
Here's the funny thing: The next month, I still got a statement, for $0. I never paid the $8 and whatever 2 months of 11% annual interest on $8 is. I called to ask why I was getting statements for $0 when I had a balance on the card that was cut up. Half the CSRs I talked to said Citi had terminated the account. The other half said I was a cardholder in good standing.
I *still* get mail and email from Citibank, like I still had that card. I got a replacement card this spring. I called up, tried to activate the card... and they can't find my account information. I asked them to stop, told them to cancel the account, not to call me with fantastic offers for Citibank cardholders (being a financial institution I've had business dealings with, they're still allowed. Bastards)... No good at all.

I have a Discover card as well. I've had good experiences with them. Every single time I've had a late payment charge I've been able to call and get 'em to remove it, going all the way back to 1995. Their interest rate is higher than my other cards, but I'm willing to keep it.

My business banking is done through 5th 3rd, which is even more evil and stupid than BankOne. I'll probably switch soon. My last few statements have included more and higher fees (the "stealth inflation" of the original post, I guess) than I'm willing to pay.

I have no debts except my mortgage. Not having to deal with debt has really made my life a lot easier than it would've been if I spent what my credit cards say I can.

Right now I'm really pissed at Verizon. I get two bills from Verizon every month, one for my cell phone, the other for telephone and DSL. I pay both online. Anyway, I paid my $100 cell phone bill last month (that's normal, for me) the same day I got notice that it had been posted, got to the screen where it said "Your Bill has been paid" and closed that browser window. But I never got a confirmation e-mail. Not a big deal; I don't normally do anything with 'em until tax time anyway.
So I went through all of November thinking my October cell bill had been paid.

Well, it hadn't.

I thought they sent reminders again before the due date for a bill. They didn't do that either. So when I looked at my bill for November, I see:

Previous Balance: $100
Assessed Late Penalties: $50something
Charges for Novemeber: $100
Total: $250something

WTF!?! $50 in late fees? For being what amounted to 1 week late in paying my previous month's bill?
Anyway, if there's justice in the world, everyone who works for Verizon will have their rectum violated with a baseball bat, sideways, in the very near future.

 

[Handruin]

Tim, one thing to keep in mind is that when you apply for any credit your credit report registers a "hit". Too many hits can look bad to someone who reviews it.

I wasn't saying that I was going to do this, just that it is an option. If my CC companies start to screw me over then I will get a new card. Hasn't happened over the last couple of years, so I don't think it is that big of deal.

Even buying too many cell phones has the potential to hurt your credit score. It's the number of inquiries against your credit that worries the lenders. Cell phone companies check your credit and therefore show as an inquiry.

As for my CC, I'm using a MC through MBNA America. I really like their shop-safe feature of virtual credit cards. I don't use my real number anywhere online any more, and I can specify a limit on the car for as low as I want with a minimum expiration date of 2 months. This comes in very handy for those first-time buys to online vendors that I'm not familiar with. Another benefit is if the site is hacked and the CC number is stolen. I can tell where it came from and I have very little potential of getting burnt because the card would likely have expired.

I had a master card during college and at the end of college I canceled it because there was an erroneous charge made to Yankee candle store... Anyway, after I canceled, my parents were harassed for weeks with phone calls because they were trying to get me back as a customer. After the 10th or so call, the woman was rude to my mother. They conveniently called while I was at work, so I never spoke to them.

Other than that I have another master card with First USA. I only have one reoccurring charge on that card and it's never been used anywhere else. I have no problems with them.

 

[Clocker]

If you guys are looking for a good interest rate, check out Demand Notes. The rate is excellent although not FDIC ensured it is as secure as any good money market fund. Demand Notes have been around for a long time and consistently provide great interest rates. You can use it just like a checking account too....

http://www.gmacfs.com/notes/demand/main.htm


If you're interested and want more info, let me know and I will have an info packet sent out to you (I get a $25 referral credit if you sign up):

http://www.gmacnotes.net/demand/pages/gmac_descrp.htm

C

 

[e_dawg]

CitiBank is so far the one credit card company I refuse to do business with. I had been a long-time cardmember and closed my account as I had migrated to lower-interest, no annual fee cards. About 8 months later, I receive a bill with a charge on it for a magazine subscription renewal. Citibank had opened my closed account and posted a charge to it. Absolutely unacceptable. While I got the charge cancelled and the account re-closed, they never could explain how it happened in the first place. I wholeheartedly encourage any and everyone to not do business with Citibank.

I think you are describing a common practice. The way you're supposed to close an account (apparently) is to call and say I lost my card and ask them to cancel it and send you a new one. This new card will have a new account number on it. Don't activate it (unless it's already pre-activated) and don't use it. Just leave it. It you wish, you can cancel that card, which shouldn't pose a problem with subsequent charges reopening your account, because nobody would have your number if you didn't use it.

 

[CityK]

Wow, a lot to reply to / comment on, but here goes:

If nothing else, the bank should have provided some warning that online payments would take longer than usual after whatever changes they made.

I note that the back of my CC statement quips that:

it is your responsibility to ensure that payments are received by us by the Payment Due Date shown on the front of this statement. If we receive a payment from you after what we consider to be our normal business hours, that payment will be treated as having been received by us on the next business day

Like I said, I never had a problem before paying online like I always do on the due date.

I still think it's asinine that I have to lose ten days interest each month because of these changes.

I completely agree. The fact of the matter is, the CC starts accumulating interest on your payment the second you transfer it....yet it takes them ten days to "confirm the fund transfer and update your account"..Phhhheww. I smell a truck load of BS.

Another thing annoying me about banks is the cheap interest they're paying even though they're still charging the same high interest on outstanding credit card balances.

And the excuses they use to justify those high interest rates on CC are laughable - too many people carrying balances on their accounts. Yet, isn't it the same CC co.'s that keep sending out little contest brouchres in their statements - "use your MC/Visa and you could win this trip, or cash back or whatever...." Nothing like encouraging people with bad spending habits to extend them selves even further.

I'm getting more annoyed at banks each day

You should try working for one - it ain't any rosier on the inside

Another thing with CC companies is how they send those stupid blank checks. It annoys me that I have to call each of my CC companies and request them to stop sending every month. I also had to request from my own CC company that they STOP callling me.

A couple of years ago (back when I was in university), one of my roomates would constantly receive calls from his CC (MBNA) about this stupid offer or that stupid offer. One day he just told them don't ever call me again, and that was the end of them.

I'm using a MC through MBNA America.

Hmm, that would explain it.

Not to be nosey or anything, but what cards have you guys had problems with

Its a Visa issued from a Cdn bank, so it probably won't make a difference to you...yet.

Once you have seen the correction clear call them back and thank them for clearing up that incident and then tell them that you would now like to talk about the general practice.

I was thinking of writing a letter, but then I thought ah the hell with it, I don't use this card much anyways so I'm just going to cancel it. I did, recieve the new statement yesterday, and the charge has been removed.

I now understand that you guys are talking about going to the CC website and asking them to withdraw X amount from you bank account....I have stopped this practice altogether. I don't want any company to have enough information that they can withdraw from my account "accidently". I always "push" my payments, rather than "pull".

No, no. I pay my bills manually online. For the very reasons you outline, I never agree or sign up for preauthourized payment plans...that's like issuing a license for trouble. I have seen so many compliants in the papers about consumers who get shafted one way or another because they had entered into a preauthourized plan that just never seems to know when to quit! Resolving these issues can take months, and complaining to your CC does you know good, cause as far as they are concerned, its between you and the retailer/service.

As soon as I feel more comfortable with mutual funds I'm investing the bulk of it there.

JTR, your a smart fellow and you have sufficient knowledge already to actively manage your own money. I highly advise you to take it upon yourself to do your own investing....if you really don't want to be too active with it, then look into ETF's .

don't know about CityK, but what I do each month is transfer money at Chase online for my bills from my checking to savings account. After that I pay my CC bill online at the same site(and same session). They debit my checking account immediately but there is a delay before the amount gets credited to my CC. I have complete control over when and how much is paid, at least up until the point the payment goes to my CC. After that, it is anyone's guess when the payment is deducted from my charge card balance. I don't believe in automatic bill paying.

Thats pretty much the case with me too.

I don't know what you guy`s are complaining about it is called capitalism, the more money you have in a bank the better service you get the less money you have the poorer service you will receive

It has nothing to do with capitalism or how much or little you have in your bank account. Its about what appears to be changing business practices that heavily favour the bottom line of the banks. Consider this, if you make a purchase on your CC late tonight (Sat) at some vendor in a mall, there is a high probability that the charge doesn't get posted to the account until Mon. Needless to say, when you get your bill, you will obseve both a transaction and posting date. Now suppose you don't pay your bill and instead carry a balance. What date do you think the bank will use to charge you retail interest? You have two guesses, and it ain't Monday.
So then, how can a bank receive your money (stated as transaction date on the statement), then collect interest on that payment, yet fail to account for that payment until the "posting date", and then deem you late for payment and tac a interest charge to your account?
You can't have things cut both ways....not unless your a money grubbing institution that will try everything in its power to push the envelop of what is deemed ethical and acceptable practice.

The only exceptions are a couple of bills like my cel phone I link to a credit card for the bonus points.

I'm not really into rewards programs. To me, they are kind of like throwing a dog a bone to placate him....meanwhile the dollar figure that could be placed on the invaluable marketing information and transaction deals made with participating co's/sponsers can be substantial coin.

Tim, one thing to keep in mind is that when you apply for any credit your credit report registers a "hit". Too many hits can look bad to someone who reviews it.

Its a condition that they call "credit seeking".

I have eventually been able to consolodate all my credit card debts onto one card with a 2.9% rate for the life of the debt and no annual fee. I was even able to get the limit raised to accomodate. Execept for that and this stupid card I'm getting ready to cancel, I'm off the plastic.

Sounds like a good plan.

My personal accounts are BankOne. BankOne is a viscious, evil institution that introduced the "Pay $3 to talk to a bank teller" fee about five years ago.

A couple of the Cdn banks introduced similar ridiculus in person charges about then too. They really wanted to encourage the online banking. Now I hear that the online transaction charges are starting to get ridiculus too....I wouldn't know though as I use a no fee bank account.

I can do even the most complex personal transactions at an ATM. I've never even talked to a teller there. Almost every Walgreens in Illinois and Indiana has an ATM, so I'm never THAT far from my money. I do absolutely all my transactions with a debit card. I kept my accounting for my personal account for several years; they haven't made a mistake yet, so now I'm satisfied with looking at my statements on line. Saves me hassle.

Indeed, that is exactly how I proceed. I don't recall the last time I talked to a teller


Whew! I'm not going to bother editing. That just took too, long.

CK

 

[e_dawg]

Another article on credit card companies

http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Banking/Yourcreditrating/P51865.asp

 

[Pradeep]

I believe the optimum number of credit cards on your credit report is 4-5. They will mark you down if you are using too much of your available credit (>50% of balance), and bizzarely enough, if you have no balance at all (you could go crazy and max em all out at once).

If a lender gets a proper report (and not just a number) then they will be able to see the hits on your account, they aren't going to worry about a hit from Verizon or an insurance company etc. If you have hits from 10 different CC companies you may have trouble.

Apparently they also use an algorithm so that you are not penalised if you are out rate shopping (for a car or house loan for example). I think that's for a 2 week period.

 

[jtr1962]

They will mark you down if you are using too much of your available credit (>50% of balance), and bizzarely enough, if you have no balance at all (you could go crazy and max em all out at once).

You mean you get penalized for paying your balance in full each month the way I do? It's almost as if they want people to carry balances. I learned that carrying debt is never a good thing. Sometimes it's unavoidable with a big ticket purchase like a house, but generally I see debt as a bad thing in that if your income stops you get in trouble very quickly. Also, the money spent for interest could be put to better use (i.e. in an account earning interest for you).

 

[Mercutio]

That is in fact true. You are penalized for not carrying a balance.
I've heard of banks cancelling cards belonging to people who pay their full bill every month. We aren't profitable enough.

Also, it's possible to ruin someone's credit COMPLETELY by having five or six different credit agencies do two or three credit checks in a short period of time (say, a couple weeks). Very cheap revenge - you end up spending maybe $120, they end up not being able to buy a house or a car for seven years.

Not that I've ever done such a thing.

Also, speaking of stealth inflation: Last year, Indiana state sales tax went up 1%. Now, that's not a really big deal to me, but that is a real increase in tax burden for an awful lot of people, many of whom largely do not have an income tax burden. In short, it's a good example of a stealth inflation.

 

[sechs]

No, it's regressive taxation. Sales taxes, unfortunately, tend to be highly regressive.

 

[ddrueding]

I'm still happy with my cash-only lifestyle....I haven't used an ATM in 3 years. I have a business account, and it holds a balance (a few grand) that I cover my business AMEX from, and cash checks out of. I'm quite the regular there, just walk up to the counter with a check and they hand me cash. No forms or anything.

 

[Mercutio]

I'd say an increased sales tax is a hidden cost. Granted, I got a bunch of documents saying that I would have to charge higher taxes on goods I re-sell, but even a year later, everything I buy locally, I still have that long pause where I think "this should cost a couple bucks less", before I remember the #%^% tax.

Cash sucks. I hate bills. I hate coins. I want a card with a little display that tells me how much money I have and a nice central database where I can look at all my transactions. I've had the same two $20 bills in my money clip for the last six weeks. That's how often I buy anything with cash.

 

[ddrueding]

Cash is nice, coins do suck. Anytime I recvieve coins, I leave them right there. At the register, as part of a tip, whatever. The number of times brick and mortar establishments give me better treatment with cash is amazing. Just pull out a wad of $100s and that clerk can help you right now. Works best with jewlers .

 

[Mercutio]

Um. Yeah. Just go ahead and remind me what my wears-my-one-caret-and-platinum-engagement-ring-below-the-waist Ex- is doing in San Francisco this weekend.

Thanks David.

I swear it's not worth talking to people, ever.

 

[e_dawg]

I didn't quite catch that, Merc. Did you just say "she wears your ring below the waist?" :mrgrn:

 

[sechs]

On a toe is a bit of an odd place.

 

[Mercutio]

One could only wish it were a toe.

 

[ddrueding]

Um. Yeah. Just go ahead and remind me what my wears-my-one-caret-and-platinum-engagement-ring-below-the-waist Ex- is doing in San Francisco this weekend.

Thanks David.

I swear it's not worth talking to people, ever.

Ugh, thanks for rubbing it in, Merc

But I think she pawned it

I was just in SF visiting a mutual friend...don't know what happened to her.

 

[its.fubar]

I don't know what you guy`s are complaining about it is called capitalism, the more money you have in a bank the better service you get the less money you have the poorer service you will receive

It has nothing to do with capitalism or how much or little you have in your bank account. Its about what appears to be changing business practices that heavily favour the bottom line of the banks. Consider this, if you make a purchase on your CC late tonight (Sat) at some vendor in a mall, there is a high probability that the charge doesn't get posted to the account until Mon. Needless to say, when you get your bill, you will obseve both a transaction and posting date. Now suppose you don't pay your bill and instead carry a balance. What date do you think the bank will use to charge you retail interest? You have two guesses, and it ain't Monday.
So then, how can a bank receive your money (stated as transaction date on the statement), then collect interest on that payment, yet fail to account for that payment until the "posting date", and then deem you late for payment and tac a interest charge to your account?
You can't have things cut both ways....not unless your a money grubbing institution that will try everything in its power to push the envelop of what is deemed ethical and acceptable practice.[/quote]


CityK: I believe that you are simply missing the fact that you must have money in your account to pay for the purchase you are making unless you are living on credit First they are making money on what you have in your account and then they charge you for using it that is capitalism at fines.