I need a drink

I'm sorry to hear about all of your misfortunes Mercutio. I don't have any advice for you, but I do believe that you'll manage. I would hope that there is now closure (albeit painfully memorable), and that you will press forward.
 
I would also like to wish my best to you. I'm also sorry to hear of the misfortunes.
 
I was divorced about three years ago, after my ex started seeing someone else behind my back. One of the things that I learned through that experience was that no one person could tell me how I should feel or deal with my feelings. I had a lot of advice, a lot of people that wanted to help but were just a bit misguided. I didn't blame them, I would know how to react to someone going through a similar situation unless I had been through it myself. The most fulfilling and healing moments were hiking with my dad, who somehow understood that silence and peace were sometimes the best healers. And I also relied on my faith in God to bring me through the pain. I can say now that I am a much stronger person because of the experience.

Merc, every situation is different, every relationship is as unique as the people involved, and no one can tell you exactly how to respond or act given a situation. It has always been my experience that we know in our heart what is the right decision and what is the wrong decision. It is how we respond to what is in our heart that makes the difference.

I wish you well, however the situation turns out.
 
The consensus view appears to be that you are a fool, Mercutio, that you are crazy to let your feelings twist you into being an ongoing support for a woman that no longer loves you.

Well, to hell with consensus!

You make your own decision, you follow your own heart, and you stick things through. Difficult? Of course it's difficult, quite possibly more difficult than making a clean break and casting Amy out of your life. But the dificulty is at least in the same order of magnitude: it's maybe 50% harder than just walking away and starting afresh with nothing; with no goal, no purpose, no love and no hope.

I don't mean that there is no hope, I mean that you feel no hope. No matter how you deal with this current crisis, you are unlikely to feel any sense of hope or optimism about your future for quite some time, at least a year or so. Perhaps longer. And that will be true no matter what you do. So you just have to learn to operate without feeling hope. It's neither pleasant nor easy, but nothing you can do will take this burden away from you, and there is nothing bar the passage of time that will make it less painful, so you might as well do as you are already doing, and plan on doing something useful with your otherwise wasted year.

Amy has made it impossible for you to love her in the conventional boy-girl way any longer, but in your heart you are resolved to be a loyal and true friend to her despite everything. Good! That is true love at work. It will cost you a great deal of pain but in the long run it will be worthwhile.

There will come a time in the future when you are attracted to someone else and begin a new relationship. Don't worry about that for now. In fact, don't ever worry about that. It will come along when the time is ripe and there is nothing you can do to hurry it, and not much you can do to delay it. In fact the worst thing you can do is waste time and energy hoping for it or trying to bring it about. It will come in its own good time, not before. Turn your attention to other things, to the "little" things that you probably don't care about at present, like eating well and looking after your health and doing something to improve your home, your career or your financial prospects. Sure, right now none of these things have any meaning or importance to you. Do them anyway.

And if you are resolved to be the best friend you can be to Amy in the meantime, to go on seeing her despite the pain it brings you, then so be it. Most of that pain is pain you would feel in any case, whether you see her or not, and the inner turmoil of seeing your ex is probably not all that much worse than the inner turmoil of not seeing her.

Be who you are.
 
Ah Tony, you're older than me and still much less cynical. I'm glad, keep it up.

I'm afraid I'm now more a "rip the bandaid off" type than the "slow removal" type. My experience has led me to believe that often I was doing something for what I thought were all the best reasons, but turned out to be what others expected of me or what I thought I should do in the situation. Neither was good for anyone in the long run.

Merc, Tony's certainly right in implying that the only person who can sort things out for you is you; all the words in the world aren't going to change that.
 
Thank you for kind and thoughtful words. Particularly Tannin's last sentiment, and Dozer, a person whose name is not familiar to me.

I wish I knew what more I could say. Probably nothing. There has been precious little joy in my life these last few months, and I am glad for the distraction I've had here from time to time.
 
I wish there was a word in English to describe someone whose relationship is not romantic nor a matter of heritage but nonetheless indicative of familial closeness.
 
Mercutio said:
I wish there was a word in English to describe someone whose relationship is not romantic nor a matter of heritage but nonetheless indicative of familial closeness.
Click to expand...

Hartiverence

Har - ti - ver - ence

Someone whose relationship is not romantic nor a matter of heritage but nonetheless indicative of familial closeness.


Don't bother looking it up, it shouldn't exist. I made it just for you.

:bravo:
 
(I wasn't poking fun at you, I was hoping to be silly in a good way)
 
Mercutio said:
I wish there was a word in English to describe someone whose relationship is not romantic nor a matter of heritage but nonetheless indicative of familial closeness.
Click to expand...

Phileo, Agape and Eros are three greek words used to describe love.
I believe you are looking for Phileo.
Eros is the root of erotic, so I'm sure you can figure that one out. Agape is the type of love you would have for God. Phileo is the type of love you would have for fellow man. This is as close as it gets and it's not even english.
 
Speaking for myself, I certainly don't think Mercutio is a fool by any means. The problem is he's a typical guy. Many of us have been through the same thing more or less. And we've made our share of mistakes. Sometimes though, right or wrong, there is nothing else we can bring ourselves to do. Time will sort the situation out in it's own way. And when it does Mercutio will be a more compassionate, understanding and wiser man for having suffered through, and survived it. No pain... no gain.
 
Cliptin said:
Phileo, Agape and Eros are three greek words used to describe love.
I believe you are looking for Phileo.
Eros is the root of erotic, so I'm sure you can figure that one out. Agape is the type of love you would have for God. Phileo is the type of love you would have for fellow man. This is as close as it gets and it's not even english.
Click to expand...
phileo= friendship
agape= love (real -> for God, your parents, your child)
eros= love (desire -> for your partner)
 
flagreen said:
Hey you forgot "giro" didn't you? :)
Click to expand...
Well if I start talking about this tears will come to my face. There's only one gyros-restaurant in Rome and it's in the other part of the city... Some 20-30' (by car) just to get there... Then find to park... Then order your meal... Then unpark... Drive back... [yawn]

Moreover, I'll try to keep this thread to its right level... :P
 
I'm aware of the greek (and I'm not talking about PW or NRG) terms. None of them describes the right of things for me.

Agape is probably closest, but still not right.

At any rate, I *like* Handruin's word.
 
Mercutio said:
I'm aware of the greek (and I'm not talking about PW or NRG) terms. None of them describes the right of things for me.

Agape is probably closest, but still not right.

At any rate, I *like* Handruin's word.
Click to expand...

Agape is love that does not depend on the receiver only on the giver. It is not necessarily emotional in nature. It is most easily identified by the need to give
Traits of Agape from I Corinthians 13:
Agape endures.
Agape is kind.
Agape is not envious.
Agape is not self-serving.
Agape is not proud.
Agape does not behave unseemly.
Agape is not self-centered.
Agape is not easily provoked.
Agape does not rejoice in the bad.
It rejoices in the good.
And then the conclusion: Agape bears all things, believes
all things, hopes all things, and endures all things.

-----------------------------------
How about altruism: unselfish concern for the well-being of others.



PS At least your distracted, right!
 
Bill, I think I'm just about as far away from a typical guy as I could be on this one. I think I actually stunned the therapist I've been seeing when I explained it all to her.

Anyway, agape and eros and phileo are all words that describe love itself, not a way of describing a human relationship, and it for the relationship itself that there is no word.
 
Mercutio said:
Bill, I think I'm just about as far away from a typical guy as I could be on this one. I think I actually stunned the therapist I've been seeing when I explained it all to her.
Click to expand...
LOL about the therapist but hey, the details may be different but I would imagine the feelings are close to the same otherwise she couldn't help you I would imagine. But what do I know, I've been divorced twice and given up on relationships. No expert here by any means. :)

Anyway, agape and eros and phileo are all words that describe love itself, not a way of describing a human relationship, and it for the relationship itself that there is no word.
Click to expand...
I've had a few that defy description as well. :)
 
I am so glad I found this thread. On Sunday I watched my 2 year old niece being pulled from a pond. We missed her in 20 seconds. For some god-knows-what reason, we could not bring her back. I am now downloading a song from The Grinch to play at her funeral. The agony is more than I can describe. Sorry to lay this one on anybody, but I cannot take the pain.
 
Vlad, I wish I could find the right words to say to you now. Perhaps your case is one of the few in life when you really start asking "why?" on matters that really matter...

I've seen already many times human pain, and my luck and damnation is to continue to see for the rest of my professional life.
Of course, even cancer terminal patients don't come close to the desperation in the loss of a child. :(

I only hope you (and the couple of the parents) find the psychical strength to go on and bring soon another happiness to your lives...
 
my thought too are with mercutio and vlad. you will never forget the loss but be mindful that the pain does subside. after a while you have only the best and most fond of memories which are yours to cherish forever.
 
fair enough, you are the best judge of what's good for you.

having fond memories though does not mean one is living in the past though. trying to shut them out is not that easily merc. of course at the moment whenever you think of your sitution it hurts but the beauty of fond memories is that when you think back to them you don't feel the pain that you as it was happening to you. it's then that you realise you have overcome your grief and this make you feel proud of yourself for having made it through. it just takes a little time.
 
Thankyou for your kind words. It is funny how one day you can get up in thr morning and everything is OK. By bedtime your whole world has been destroyed, and you cannot even know why. My grief has tramusted into a deep and profound sadness. Although I am around people I feel barren and alone.

Hmm... Temazepan and vodka do funny things to the brain. I will sleep the dreamless sleep of sleeping pills and then face tomorrow. I have to read out a poem I have chosen to remember her by.

Cloud Song by A.A Milne

How sweet to be a cloud
Floating in the Blue!
Every little cloud
alwayssings aloud.

"How sweet be a Cloud
Floating in the Blue!"
It makes her very proud
To be a little cloud.
 
The Roadside Fire.

I will make you brooches and toys for your delight
Of bird-song at morning and star-shine at night,
I will make a palace fit for you and me
Of green days in forests, and blue days at sea.

I will make my kitchen, and you shall keep your room,
Where white flows the river and bright blows the broom;
And you shall wash your linen and keep your body white
In rainfall at morning and dewfall at night.

And this shall be for music when no one else is near,
The fine song for singing, the rare song to hear!
That only I remember, that only you admire,
Of the broad road that stretches and the roadside fire.


-- R. L. Stevenson.
 
For Vlad:

Sleep, baby sleep, our cottage vale is deep,
the little lamb is on the green,
with snowy fleece so soft and clean,
Sleep, baby sleep.

Sleep, baby sleep, I would not would not weep,
The little lamb he never cries,
for bright and happy are his eyes,
Sleep, baby sleep,

Sleep, baby sleep,
near where the woodbines creep,
Be always like the lamb so mild,
a sweet and kind and gentle child,
Sleep, baby sleep.

Sleep, baby sleep,
Thy rest shall angels keep.
While on the grass the lamb shall feed,
and never suffer want or need,
Sleep, baby sleep.

-- Anon.

... and for myself

Come, you whose loves are dead,
And whiles I sing,
Weep and wring
Ev'ry hand, ev'ry head
Bind with cypress and sad yew,
Ribbons black and candles blue,
For him that was of men most true.

Come with heavy moaning,
And on his grave
Let him have
Sacrifice of sighs and groaning.
Let him have fair flow'rs enow,
White and purple, green and yellow,
For him that was of men most true.

- F. Beaumont


... and for both of us, with an obvious change in pronoun.

Heart, we will forget him
You and I, tonight.
You may forget the warmth he gave,
I will forget the light.

When you have done, pray tell me,
That I my thoughts may dim;
Haste! lest while you're lagging,
I may remember him!

- E. Dickinson.
 
I'm very sorry to hear the terrible news Vlad...my deepest sympathies to you. :(
 
Mercutio:

You have touched me in a way that is deeper than you can ever imagine. Thankyou for showing me that not everything is mean and nasty. For you:


They say that 'time assuages,'--
Time never did assuage;
An actual suffering strengthens,
As sinews do, with age.

Time is a test of trouble,
But not a remedy.
If such it prove, it prove too
There was no malady.

by Emily Dickinson
 
Cliptin:

She was just like me and my brother when we where her age. She had curly locks of hair, and a big smile. She frowned when she was thinking, and she loved toy windmills that blew in the breeze. She liked fairy stories and Winnie The Pooh. She loved to blow bubbles with soapy water. Everybody at the funeral is going to blow bubbles in the Church. Her favourite film was 'The Grinch' We have put the film and Winnie and Tigger in with her to look after her.

She loved our Cat; we used to call her smiler-cat. She hugged all of us before she had to go. I have found out from the Post-mortem that she did not drown. There was no water in her lungs. She was only in the water for about 10 seconds before we got her out. Her throat contracted to make sure that she did not swallow any water and her heart stopped. We could not have revived her if we had got her out in 1 second. She was gone before she hit the water; a fact that helps with the guilt a lot.

It was meant to be this way, with all of the people she loved around her at the same time. It is rare for all of us to be together, so if she had to go, that was the best time.

I was not, and still am not a religious person, but I know that somebody we know and love came for her to save her from something else. She has been to see all of us in different ways, to make sure that we are OK. I woke up and felt her lying on my chest giving me a huggle. I caught the scent of her newly washed hair, so I know she is being well looked after by my departed Grandparents.

All of this helps, but it does not answer the big question of why?
 
I don't think "why" is a question anyone ultimately will know the answer to. Amy fought her fight and asked "why" every day until she finally decided to accept who she is. Now I ask "why" she stayed in my bed as long as she did (because she loves me, and she was too scared to see the truth.)

"Why?" is the universal question. Finding a "why" is a reason for being, a journey, a destination we will never reach.

I'm not a person who thinks everything happens for a reason, or that there's a cosmic balance somewhere, weighing karma or the heaviness of your heart. But life is the billion of lessons you learn over days and weeks and months. Life is experience and yes, memory and the present moment. Life is precious, something to embrace in the brief time we all have.

In a time such as yours, Vlad, all I can say is that you can be glad for all the time you got with your niece, and for all the little marks she made on your life.

I hope that's enough, because that's the only comfort, of my own words - not those of poets - that I can offer.
 
VLAD,

I’m sorry to hear about your loss. Unforeseen circumstances befall us all, and they are not always the easiest to deal with.

PS: I apologize for not addressing you by your real name, regrettably it fails my memory.
 
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