Interesting "survey" - user comments on Raptors
- Thread starter LiamC
- Start date
Jake the Dog
Storage is cool
interesting yes but Iwonder how qualified this "Ed" is to draw any valid conclusions (not that he pretends to be a survery analysis genius). like the most, I like my Raptor too. it's fast, not noisy and reasonably cool but then I mount it carefully in a well ventilated spot, just as any drive should be.
a similarly interesting survey would be LCD vs CRT. almost all LCD owner comments I've read, of recent LCD models, have been positive. nearly all of the negative comments I read are from CRT owners who have yet to try one. apart from cost which is indeed a major point, all the the arguments used against LCD are old and no longer valid. I've yet to come across a CRT owner who had a LCD and went back to CRT.
a similarly interesting survey would be LCD vs CRT. almost all LCD owner comments I've read, of recent LCD models, have been positive. nearly all of the negative comments I read are from CRT owners who have yet to try one. apart from cost which is indeed a major point, all the the arguments used against LCD are old and no longer valid. I've yet to come across a CRT owner who had a LCD and went back to CRT.
Buck
Storage? I am Storage!
I've had LCDs and was happy to see them go. I appreciated the sharpness of the LCD, but not the contrast and brightness.
Jake the Dog
Storage is cool
I gather this was before the 500:1 contrast, 250cd+ most recent (<6 mth) LCD's have?
Tea
Storage? I am Storage!
Jake the Dog said:
Hello Jake. Pleased to meet you. My name is Tea.
blakerwry
Storage? I am Storage!
Tea, I through for sure you;d enjoy poking the LCD and making it create all those neat colors!
Tannin
Storage? I am Storage!
Now that you have finished grandstanding, small hairy one, perhaps you will permit me to make a few comments of my own.
Yes Jake: I'm a CRT owner that went to LCD and came bact to CRTs. Twice.
My frst desktop LCD was a small one. 12 inch was it? 800 x 600, anyway. It was a Samsung panel atached to a Dual LCD-PC, which started life as a ... er .... probably a K6-233, and went on through a variety of reincarnations, finishing up as a K6-III/450, I think. No, it was an overclocked K6-III+ @550 or so. Drive-wise, it had the Awesome Foursome: 4 drives, all SCSI, two of them 1st-gen 10K units (in an external box, of course). It might have been small, but it sure was loud!
That was, oh, maybe 2 years or more? A long time in this game.
Even when I first got it, there were bigger LCD screens around (though still uncommon) but they just couldn't cut it for image quality. The sharpness and clarity of the 12 inch screen was unmatched. I must have had a 17 inch CRT before that. A Videocom, I imagine. Never missed it for a moment.
One day it died. Kaput! Just like that. I couldn't get it repaired (no parts available, of course) so I stole the office Mag 19 inch CRT, and ordered a new Hitachi 19 for work, a simply superb CM753ET.
Going from the LCD to the CRT was OK. I missed the absolute flicker-free nature of the LCD, and the wonderful clarity, but appreciated the extra size and ability to run 1024 x 768. 12 inches to 19 inches is a lot of inches. (Err ... I seem to be sounding like Tea all of a sudden.)
Then I retired the Mag to the Belinda house, flirted briefly with an entry-level NEC 19 (it lasted a week - it was crap), and (once again) said To Hell with it, where is the cheque book?. I took the CM753 home and bought a Mitsubishi 21 for the office. Wonderful monitor. I still have it.
I kept my eye on LCDs through the 14 inch and 15 inch offerings, but in the end they were just not quite as sharp as the old 12 inch Samsung - and if an LCD ain't sharp, it ain't worth having. I took a 15 inch Acer home for a few days, and ran it on the Matrox dual display, but eventually decided it wasn't up to scratch. Ther were better ones around, but rather dear.
A couple of months ago, seeing as I have been spending so long looking at pictures lately (all birds - but not the sort Mercutio likes, the other sort) I decided that the old Hitachi 19 wasn't quite cutting the mustard anymore - they do decay over time, little by little.
I took a Mitsubishi 17" LCD home, unplugged the Hitachi CRT. Wonderful things! 500:1 contrast ratio, and clear as a bell. 1280 x 1024 is a perfet screen res, by the way. I really liked the extra space. The first generation of larger LCD monitors that are really and truly sharp enough to match my Mitsubish 21 (or my old 12 inch Samsung.)
But it bugged me. That flickery rainbow scrolling was jarring on the eye, and I wasn't entirely convinced about the smaller screen size. (17 inch viewable vs 18 on the Hitachi CRT or 20 at work on the Mitsubishi.) Something wasn't quite right.
So I took another one home: an Albatron 17 inch 500:1 LCD with built-in TV tuner. (I was toying with the idea of giving away my TV.) Ran them side-by-side for three or four days. They were different. The Mitsubishi was sharper and clearer, but the Albatron didn't do funny things when scrolling text. I looked at more and more bird photographs - that's the main purpose of the machine these days - and couldn't make up my mind which one to keep. Overall, the Mitsubishi was best for photograps, but the Albatron for text. But I still wasn't entirely convinced.
One night, I spat the dummy and plugged the old Hitachi CM753 back in. Much better!
I sold the LCD screens and have not regretted it for a moment. I'm typing on the Hitachi as we speak ... er ... as I type. Or something.
(Tea! Will you stop bloody giving me bad habits! I can't even write properly since you've been around.)
Yes Jake: I'm a CRT owner that went to LCD and came bact to CRTs. Twice.
My frst desktop LCD was a small one. 12 inch was it? 800 x 600, anyway. It was a Samsung panel atached to a Dual LCD-PC, which started life as a ... er .... probably a K6-233, and went on through a variety of reincarnations, finishing up as a K6-III/450, I think. No, it was an overclocked K6-III+ @550 or so. Drive-wise, it had the Awesome Foursome: 4 drives, all SCSI, two of them 1st-gen 10K units (in an external box, of course). It might have been small, but it sure was loud!
That was, oh, maybe 2 years or more? A long time in this game.
Even when I first got it, there were bigger LCD screens around (though still uncommon) but they just couldn't cut it for image quality. The sharpness and clarity of the 12 inch screen was unmatched. I must have had a 17 inch CRT before that. A Videocom, I imagine. Never missed it for a moment.
One day it died. Kaput! Just like that. I couldn't get it repaired (no parts available, of course) so I stole the office Mag 19 inch CRT, and ordered a new Hitachi 19 for work, a simply superb CM753ET.
Going from the LCD to the CRT was OK. I missed the absolute flicker-free nature of the LCD, and the wonderful clarity, but appreciated the extra size and ability to run 1024 x 768. 12 inches to 19 inches is a lot of inches. (Err ... I seem to be sounding like Tea all of a sudden.)
Then I retired the Mag to the Belinda house, flirted briefly with an entry-level NEC 19 (it lasted a week - it was crap), and (once again) said To Hell with it, where is the cheque book?. I took the CM753 home and bought a Mitsubishi 21 for the office. Wonderful monitor. I still have it.
I kept my eye on LCDs through the 14 inch and 15 inch offerings, but in the end they were just not quite as sharp as the old 12 inch Samsung - and if an LCD ain't sharp, it ain't worth having. I took a 15 inch Acer home for a few days, and ran it on the Matrox dual display, but eventually decided it wasn't up to scratch. Ther were better ones around, but rather dear.
A couple of months ago, seeing as I have been spending so long looking at pictures lately (all birds - but not the sort Mercutio likes, the other sort) I decided that the old Hitachi 19 wasn't quite cutting the mustard anymore - they do decay over time, little by little.
I took a Mitsubishi 17" LCD home, unplugged the Hitachi CRT. Wonderful things! 500:1 contrast ratio, and clear as a bell. 1280 x 1024 is a perfet screen res, by the way. I really liked the extra space. The first generation of larger LCD monitors that are really and truly sharp enough to match my Mitsubish 21 (or my old 12 inch Samsung.)
But it bugged me. That flickery rainbow scrolling was jarring on the eye, and I wasn't entirely convinced about the smaller screen size. (17 inch viewable vs 18 on the Hitachi CRT or 20 at work on the Mitsubishi.) Something wasn't quite right.
So I took another one home: an Albatron 17 inch 500:1 LCD with built-in TV tuner. (I was toying with the idea of giving away my TV.) Ran them side-by-side for three or four days. They were different. The Mitsubishi was sharper and clearer, but the Albatron didn't do funny things when scrolling text. I looked at more and more bird photographs - that's the main purpose of the machine these days - and couldn't make up my mind which one to keep. Overall, the Mitsubishi was best for photograps, but the Albatron for text. But I still wasn't entirely convinced.
One night, I spat the dummy and plugged the old Hitachi CM753 back in. Much better!
I sold the LCD screens and have not regretted it for a moment. I'm typing on the Hitachi as we speak ... er ... as I type. Or something.
(Tea! Will you stop bloody giving me bad habits! I can't even write properly since you've been around.)
Tannin
Storage? I am Storage!
The bottom line, Jake, is that for photography, LCDs don't cut it. You just can't trust the colours.
Another thing about those two 17 inch wonders. The Albatron was styled like a tacky Korean motorbike: all swishy lines and sharp angles in silver-grey. Yuk! The Mitsubishi was in black. They look rahter snazzy, but the reality is, our brain-dead web designers make most web pages white with dark text, and the contrast between the black surround and the white screen causes eye-strain. Screen bodies have been white for all these years for a reason, it seems.
Not long afterwards, I gave the 15 inch A-Open on the desk in the showroom (I've had that for about 15 months, I guess) to my brother and bought another Mitsubishi 17 LCD - in white this time, which improves them considerably. In the showrom, it serves a triple duty: (a) we run Quattro Pro on it for pricing (plus a little light duty web surfing and stuff), (b) it demonstrates that despte the lack of fresh paint and the piles of old computer bits lying around everywhere, we do actually make some money sometimes and might even be still in business next year, just in case anyone is thinking of buying a computer. (c) It's a showroom display as well - people look at it if they are thinking of buying one.
There, running spreadsheets all day, the LCD is perfect. Much better than any CRT. I wouldn't replace that one with a CRT. Last week, a fellow bought it, so it's got a 17 inch CRT just for the moment till I order more Mitsubishi LCDs - or more to the point, till he pays for the 20 inch Mitsubishi he ordered to go with it and I have some spare cash again.
That is one big mother of an LCD, the Mitsubishi 20.1.
According to the specs, the contrast ratio isn't so great - 350:1, I think. So we plugged it in and tried it out. It's certainly impressive, but there is something subtly not-quite-right about it, just like the 14 and 15 inch ones used to be back when I had my 12 inch. You can look at it and look at it, but whatever you do, it isn't quite right. It's so very close, and yet you keep moving your head a tiny bit, this way and that, trying to resove the picture into the absolute clarity that it promises, promises, promises - but never quite delivers.
No 20 inch LCD for me. Not till they get the picture quality as good as it is on the 17 inch 500:1 models. (And possibly not till they cost a good deal less than the $2300-odd this one cost.)
The Mitsubishi 22 inch CRT, on the other hand, is simply superb. I've sold two or three of them, and they can't be beat. I'm gong on holiday shortly so there is no point in ordering one right away, but as soon as I get back, I'm getting a Mitsubishi 22 inch CRT and taking it home.
Another thing about those two 17 inch wonders. The Albatron was styled like a tacky Korean motorbike: all swishy lines and sharp angles in silver-grey. Yuk! The Mitsubishi was in black. They look rahter snazzy, but the reality is, our brain-dead web designers make most web pages white with dark text, and the contrast between the black surround and the white screen causes eye-strain. Screen bodies have been white for all these years for a reason, it seems.
Not long afterwards, I gave the 15 inch A-Open on the desk in the showroom (I've had that for about 15 months, I guess) to my brother and bought another Mitsubishi 17 LCD - in white this time, which improves them considerably. In the showrom, it serves a triple duty: (a) we run Quattro Pro on it for pricing (plus a little light duty web surfing and stuff), (b) it demonstrates that despte the lack of fresh paint and the piles of old computer bits lying around everywhere, we do actually make some money sometimes and might even be still in business next year, just in case anyone is thinking of buying a computer. (c) It's a showroom display as well - people look at it if they are thinking of buying one.
There, running spreadsheets all day, the LCD is perfect. Much better than any CRT. I wouldn't replace that one with a CRT. Last week, a fellow bought it, so it's got a 17 inch CRT just for the moment till I order more Mitsubishi LCDs - or more to the point, till he pays for the 20 inch Mitsubishi he ordered to go with it and I have some spare cash again.
That is one big mother of an LCD, the Mitsubishi 20.1.
According to the specs, the contrast ratio isn't so great - 350:1, I think. So we plugged it in and tried it out. It's certainly impressive, but there is something subtly not-quite-right about it, just like the 14 and 15 inch ones used to be back when I had my 12 inch. You can look at it and look at it, but whatever you do, it isn't quite right. It's so very close, and yet you keep moving your head a tiny bit, this way and that, trying to resove the picture into the absolute clarity that it promises, promises, promises - but never quite delivers.
No 20 inch LCD for me. Not till they get the picture quality as good as it is on the 17 inch 500:1 models. (And possibly not till they cost a good deal less than the $2300-odd this one cost.)
The Mitsubishi 22 inch CRT, on the other hand, is simply superb. I've sold two or three of them, and they can't be beat. I'm gong on holiday shortly so there is no point in ordering one right away, but as soon as I get back, I'm getting a Mitsubishi 22 inch CRT and taking it home.
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
And that's why no monitor with black color passes TCO'99 or TCO'03, only TCO'95. You'll often see monitors that are available in both black and grey/white/silver and the black one, which is absolutely identical to the paler model, never features more than TCO'95 compliance while the other one is often at least TCO'99 (or more rarely TCO'03).Tannin said:
Tannin
Storage? I am Storage!
Is that right! And I thought it was just one of my personal fetish items. Interesting.
Fushigi
Storage Is My Life
Sorry, but I've got to disagree. My NEC-Mitsu Diamond Pro 930SB with a black cabinet (DP930SB-BK) is TCO99 certified. It is documented as such and I just verified it at the TCO web site.CougTek said:
mubs
Storage? I am Storage!
So, Tannin, how 'bout some specifics? I mean model #s of your favourite CRTs (and perhaps LCDs).
TIA.
TIA.
Tannin
Storage? I am Storage!
Right now, I like these:
Link to the 22
Link to the TFT
The 22, by the way, is a new model. I gather it has had excellent reviews, and is a noticable improvement on the old one.
- Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 2070SB: 22 inch (20 viewable) Natural Flat Diamondtron picture tube, 0.24 mm pitch, 30 - 140 kHz, 2048 x 1536 at 86 Hz.
- Mitsubishi DV172: 17 inch TFT
Link to the 22
Link to the TFT
The 22, by the way, is a new model. I gather it has had excellent reviews, and is a noticable improvement on the old one.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
Egads, I hope you aren't pushing 22" displays on ALL your customers.
Or 17" LCDs for that matter?
For new displays I am deeply fond of the KDS XF-7T. I buy them new for a smidge over $100. They're 12x10 but .25dp and do 10x7 @ 100Hz+ and seem to have uniformly nice, bright screen image.
Er, not that anyone asked me.
Or 17" LCDs for that matter?
For new displays I am deeply fond of the KDS XF-7T. I buy them new for a smidge over $100. They're 12x10 but .25dp and do 10x7 @ 100Hz+ and seem to have uniformly nice, bright screen image.
Er, not that anyone asked me.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
Also, WRT Raptors, I have run across them perhaps half-a-dozen times now, and more than any other drive I can remember, they have been as non-uniform as can be.
I think I mentioned before about the noise: Some of them are as quiet as any modern 7k drive. Others have had the (SCSI) Barracuda whine. Some have been just a smidge faster, subjectively, than 7k PATA drives. Other times I've thought I was using an X15.
The thing that drives me nuts in all this is that I can't make any generalizations about the silly thing. What you get seems to be completely luck of the draw. Even putting aside my current distaste for WD, that's slightly distressing.
I think I mentioned before about the noise: Some of them are as quiet as any modern 7k drive. Others have had the (SCSI) Barracuda whine. Some have been just a smidge faster, subjectively, than 7k PATA drives. Other times I've thought I was using an X15.
The thing that drives me nuts in all this is that I can't make any generalizations about the silly thing. What you get seems to be completely luck of the draw. Even putting aside my current distaste for WD, that's slightly distressing.
Fushigi
Storage Is My Life
That's what I ultimately wanted but my budget did not approve. The 930SB looks like it'll be a nice unit for me for awhile.Tannin said:
mubs
Storage? I am Storage!
Thanks, Tannin.
~ 6 years ago, I really wanted a big monitor and was drooling at the Mitsu DP2060u. Couldn't afford it. You're just confirming my prior research that its successor, the DP2070 is a top-notch monitor.
Since I'm not into exacting graphics work, though, justifying a CRT of that size, weight and power consumption is tough. A good 20" LCD would probably be better for me.
When I have the money, of course.
~ 6 years ago, I really wanted a big monitor and was drooling at the Mitsu DP2060u. Couldn't afford it. You're just confirming my prior research that its successor, the DP2070 is a top-notch monitor.
Since I'm not into exacting graphics work, though, justifying a CRT of that size, weight and power consumption is tough. A good 20" LCD would probably be better for me.
When I have the money, of course.