Looking for a computer for a friend

RWIndiana

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Greetings, all ye most intelligent ones . . . I'm looking for a decent computer, 1.6ghz or more, and under 500 dollars (total). No OS, as I would just set them up with Linux (with their usage, I think that will more than suffice for them). I'm not exactly sure what to look for. Saw some 3.2ghz on ebay that would actually be in that price range, but they are running Celeron, not Pentium. It's been so long since I've actually shopped for a computer, I'm quite rusty. I just need some tips. I don't even know what prices should be anymore. Ack!

Would this be a good deal?
 

ddrueding

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I wouldn't buy a computer on e-bay. To be clear I wouldn't really buy anything that could have complex issues, or difficult to identify flaws on ebay. Go to Costco, or Walmart, or wait for a sweet deal at Dell, and get them a new one. They do exist at that price range and your friend will thank you for it.

Right now from Dell:

Celeron D 2.5Ghz
512MB RAM
80GB HDD
DVD-Burner
17" LCD Display
XP Home

$460

Buying secondhand in a market that depreciates this fast is silly.
Buying from an individual you don't know when corporations are competitive is silly.
 

Mercutio

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Of course, I could build a Linux-based PC for $500 that would beat on that Dell like a red-headed stepchild. So could ddrueding.

If your friend doesn't need a display, something like an Athlon64/3800 with 1GB of RAM and a 160GB drive would fit pretty well in your $500 budget, just from parts you can get from Newegg.

Since your friend isn't going to run Windows, there's no particular point in making him buy a Windows license, nor pay for support of an OS he won't be using.
 

ddrueding

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That all depends on how good a friend it is. If this is someone who is interested in learning about computers and who you were planning on spending time with anyway, building a machine and doing the Linux thing sounds just fine. If, on the other hand, this is a "friend" (i.e. - someone you know but who will be too much trouble), Getting them a Dell running XP is the best possible out. Just e-mail them the link and they can do the rest.
 

ddrueding

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I actually just looked on Newegg, and $500 will now get you:

3500+
2GB RAM
160GB HDD
DVD-Burner

After the price drops, you'll be able to go dual-core for that price :eek:
 

RWIndiana

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Okay, no ebay, go Newegg. Got it. :) Actually this friend is also a cousin and neighbor, otherwise Linux would (probably) be out of the question, since they aren't really geeks.
 

RWIndiana

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I'm just wondering (told ya I haven't done this in a long time) what's the difference between an AMD socket 939 and socket AM2? And how does a 3800+ (2.0ghz) compare to the Intel 3ghz and up? Should I be looking for dual core? Is 64-bit worth it (seeing as how that's mostly all they have)? Why are SATA drives cheaper than ATA?

Okay, enough dumb questions for today. :)
 

Mercutio

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AM2 is the platform of choice for current AMD hardware. Socket 939 is classed as legacy hardware. AM2 gets you DDR2 instead of DDR (no particular benefit at the moment) and the dim possibility that you might replace a AM2/3800 with some faster AM2 chip at a later date.
64 bits doesn't really get you much of anything in Windows or in Linux, but in Linux there's no particular harm in using it, either.
An Athlon64 3800 smokes most everything Intel has in the single-core world, particularly for the price.
Dual core is generally a happy thing, but a dual core "3800" is generally slower for any single operation than a single-core "3800". 99% of the time, no one will notice when a single-core is faster than a dual core chip, but it's really easy to see the times a dual core chip is faster.
SATA drives are cheaper because more new drives are made these days with SATA interfaces than with PATA. Depending on the hardware involved, loading Windows can be somewhat more difficult on a SATA drive.

My low-end motherboard of choice at the moment is a Gigabyte GA-K8N51GMF (or the AM2-based GA-M51GM-SG2). Both use the nVidia 6100 chipset. I've loaded SuSE 10 on one, one time. SuSE did not detect or load a NIC driver; I believe this has something to do with a licensing issue with an nVidia binary-only driver, rather than a failing on the part of Linux.

I really prefer SuSE to Ubuntu.

And I *don't* think Windows is the best choice for a home user. I think spyware and all the outright SHIT that home users have to put up with: Antivirus updates, junk applications, WGA, Microsoft not releasing security updates in anything like a timely fashion, Internet Explorer... Those are all very compelling reasons not to bother when all someone wants is the ability to browse the web, get e-mail, listen to music, store photos from a camera and maybe type up the odd document, and Linux does all those things really well.

I've found that about 75% of my non-professional track students have never, ever made a folder or copied a file out of its default location. I have a really hard time believing those are people who need 100% compatibility with Microsoft Office.

Recommending Dell isn't doing a home user any favors, either, since people actually expect support when they buy a computer. I bet every single SF.net regular has had to help someone with a Dell after that person tried to call Dell's support.
 

Mercutio

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I think in the long term Nirvana will be judged superior, mostly because what's-his-name blew his face off while people still thought he had talent and because their music was SO genre-defining that even I know what it sounds like.

Pearl Jam has decades ahead to ruin whatever good name they have left by playing at county fairs and releasing crappy record after crappy record.

:)
 

timwhit

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Mercutio said:
I think in the long term Nirvana will be judged superior, mostly because what's-his-name blew his face off while people still thought he had talent and because their music was SO genre-defining that even I know what it sounds like.

Pearl Jam has decades ahead to ruin whatever good name they have left by playing at county fairs and releasing crappy record after crappy record.

:)

I agree. Plus, Nirvana actually wrote and played good music. Which, can't be said for Pearl Jam (at least when I'm saying it).
 

Handruin

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Want me to move the off-topic posts into a different thread to clean this up?
 

timwhit

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Handruin said:
Want me to move the off-topic posts into a different thread to clean this up?

I really don't think that is necessary. I don't think we/you want to set a precedent to move off-topic posts in every thread. There have been countless threads that have off-topic posts in them that have still been useful to the original poster.
 

Mercutio

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Plus there's a certain artful charm in the WAY this particular thread went off topic.
And we're already in the Off-Topic forum.
 

ddrueding

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Pearl Jam has already ruined their sound. They used to be good, then they got therapy, now they suck. Same with Guns'n'Roses, Metallica, and countless other bands. Nirvana was awesome until the depression killed Kurt Cobain, that meant they had no time to "get better" and suck.
 

RWIndiana

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Mercutio said:
Plus there's a certain artful charm in the WAY this particular thread went off topic.
And we're already in the Off-Topic forum.

I agree.

If Pearl Jam isn't on drugs anymore, that would explain it all.

Okay, so, here is my current (tentative) item list, please feel free to criticize:

Case, PSU: ~$30
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-M51GM-S2G Socket AM2 - $78.99
Processor: AMD Athlon 64 3800+ - $145.99
Memory: Kingston 1GB DDR2 - $82.99
HD: Seagate Barracuda 160GB - $57.99
Optical: DVD Burner - $30-40 (or CD-burner/DVD-ROM@ $20-25)

Total ~$430

Anything I'm missing or doing wrong?
 

RWIndiana

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oops, can't find the edit button. Anyway, I'm undecided on the OS yet. It's mainly between SuSE and Kanotix. I'm more familiar with Debian, so I'm leaning towards Kanotix.
 

LiamC

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Mercutio said:
How did this thread go so wrong so fast?

Tannin, me & no drugs. Well at least no drugs for me. :twistd:

I should elaborate on my PJ post. The last PJ album I bought was (I think) Vitalogy. As with most bands (possible exceptions being The Charlatans U.K., and probably epitomised by R.E.M), they run out of things to say. Nirvana bypassed this by the simple expedient of "blowing ones face off". So I suppose when I say PJ owns (that probably should be owned as we are talking in past tense--don't want the Grammar Police on my tail now...) Nirvana, I meant, in the same era.
 

Sol

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I'm looking at building a very similar system to that for my sister in Italy. I'm hoping I'll be able to get her up and running with Ubuntu and have Windows running in VMWare player in case of emergencies where she absolutely has to have windows for work.

With a low end dual core AM2 A64 with pacifica I'm hoping for pretty close to native performance of both OSs.

For OS choice for an linux novice I'd suggest that it'd be hard to beat the Ubuntu wiki as a source of information that your average user might actually be able to understand and use.
 

RWIndiana

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Merc, you say that this Gigabyte motherboard is what you recommend for low-end systems - what is your pick for middle of the road or high-end? Just curious.

I also have another question: I never fully grasped AMD's numbering. There are 3500+ processors that look better than higher numbers like 3800+, for example. Is higher always better in this case, even if the actual "cpu frequency" may not directly reflect that?
 

Mercutio

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I very seldom get to build "high end" systems other than my own. I normally look at Gigabyte's offerings first. I generally only proceed from there if there is some feature or set of features that is not available on a Gigabyte product.
 

RWIndiana

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This question involves someone else who wants Windows: what's the best deal for them (they already have a Windows license, so pre-installed is certainly not necessary)?
I'm guessing 32-bit and single core would be what I want here. Is AMD still better in this area? A pentium 4 3.0ghz, 800mhz FSB for ~120 doesn't look too bad.
 

RWIndiana

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Oh and do the motherboards with built-in video chipsets have Windows drivers included? I assumed they did but that could be a frustrating error.
 

Mercutio

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They may *think* they have a Windows license. In reality, unless they have a retail CD, they almost certainly don't. OEM Windows discs (sold with brand-name PCs and the "cheap copies" available at computer stores) are mated to a particular motherboard basically forever, once activated.
At least, that's what Microsoft is saying this week.

Anyway...
If you buy a motherboard with onboard graphics, you'll have to load some kind of Windows driver to make it work. The driver will be on a CD in the box with the motherboard. If you buy a brand name PC with onboard video, you'll probably have to use their specific driver for that hardware; better than half the time, the official ATI/Intel/nVidia/S3 one won't work.
 
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