Should we ban disposable batteries?
- Thread starter jtr1962
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mubs
Storage? I am Storage!
Some of you may remember my rants about rechargeable AAs in the P&S thread. I did buy gobs of Eneloops, but they didn't help. The camera is not the culprit, the flash is. It is so power hungry that the normally fast camera becomes an unusable slowpoke after a half dozen flash shots. I think the only option is to use disposable lithium AAs, which I know will cost more and screw the environment. But what to do?
The thing I don't understand is this - you have DSLRs and P&S camera that run almost forever on proprietary rechargeable lithium batts that are, say, 1250 mAH. Then you have my camera that has 4 x 2200 mAH NiMh AAs, and these run out of gas before you can say a limmerick out loud. What gives?
The thing I don't understand is this - you have DSLRs and P&S camera that run almost forever on proprietary rechargeable lithium batts that are, say, 1250 mAH. Then you have my camera that has 4 x 2200 mAH NiMh AAs, and these run out of gas before you can say a limmerick out loud. What gives?
ddrueding
Fixture
Can't comment, as I hardly ever shoot with flash.
(oh, wait. I can comment, it just isn't useful.)
(oh, wait. I can comment, it just isn't useful.)
Stereodude
Not really a
NiMH cells, eneloops specifically are very good batteries capable of pushing a lot of current (>5A) with very little voltage sag (due mainly to low internal resistance). I don't see how Lithium batteries would be any better than the eneloops. There are NiMH batteries with even less voltage sag than the eneloops, and even higher current capabilities, but it seems hard to believe that is your problem (and they're harder to find, and more expensive).
Fushigi
Storage Is My Life
I've a need for rechargeable batteries. Two needs, actually:
1. Wii remotes. 4 remotes x 2AA each.
2. Siemens cordless phone handsets. 8 handsets x 2AA each.
For the Wii, eneloops seem like the right solution. Easy decision. Use eneloops & the basic Sanyo charger.
For the handsets, I'm a little more concerned. They came with OEM 1300mAH NiMH batteries The label says SAFT ("brand" name?) RH 6, std charge: 130mA for 16 hr, quick charge: 400mA for 5 hr. The handsets are always on/in communication with the base station. They handsets also always sit on the charge stands when not in use (charging them then removing them from the stands isn't really an option). The charger output is 9.6V - 300mAH.
As the handsets come with NiMH batteries to begin with, I'm guessing the eneloops are still a good solution. Thoughts?
Also, in reviewing this thread I noted Amazon, Costco, and Thomas Distributing as sources. Are there other recommended sources? I'm not a Costco member at present.
I will likely pick up 4 or so extra AAs as well as some AAAs and the C/D cradles.
1. Wii remotes. 4 remotes x 2AA each.
2. Siemens cordless phone handsets. 8 handsets x 2AA each.
For the Wii, eneloops seem like the right solution. Easy decision. Use eneloops & the basic Sanyo charger.
For the handsets, I'm a little more concerned. They came with OEM 1300mAH NiMH batteries The label says SAFT ("brand" name?) RH 6, std charge: 130mA for 16 hr, quick charge: 400mA for 5 hr. The handsets are always on/in communication with the base station. They handsets also always sit on the charge stands when not in use (charging them then removing them from the stands isn't really an option). The charger output is 9.6V - 300mAH.
As the handsets come with NiMH batteries to begin with, I'm guessing the eneloops are still a good solution. Thoughts?
Also, in reviewing this thread I noted Amazon, Costco, and Thomas Distributing as sources. Are there other recommended sources? I'm not a Costco member at present.
I will likely pick up 4 or so extra AAs as well as some AAAs and the C/D cradles.
mubs
Storage? I am Storage!
The sources listed for Eneloops are all good. I use a Maha MH-C9000 Charger; it's reaaaaaally good.
The upper limit for charging NiMH batteries is pegged typically at 1000 mAh for fast charging. In general, the higher the charge rate the shorter the life of the battery.
As for the lower limit, NiMH batteries need to be charged at at least 30% of their rated mAh, otherwise they will usually be overcharged, leading to shortened battery life. The 30% value allows the charger to determine that the battery has reached the correct voltage and to stop charging. The Maha MH-C9000 has a host of features that give you excellent control over charging and reconditioning your rechargeables.
For the handsets, note that the two charging rates you listed are 10% and 30% of the rated capacity.
It isn't clear how 2xAA in the handset are charged at 9.6v by the charger! Somebody like jtr may be able to answer this one.
The upper limit for charging NiMH batteries is pegged typically at 1000 mAh for fast charging. In general, the higher the charge rate the shorter the life of the battery.
As for the lower limit, NiMH batteries need to be charged at at least 30% of their rated mAh, otherwise they will usually be overcharged, leading to shortened battery life. The 30% value allows the charger to determine that the battery has reached the correct voltage and to stop charging. The Maha MH-C9000 has a host of features that give you excellent control over charging and reconditioning your rechargeables.
For the handsets, note that the two charging rates you listed are 10% and 30% of the rated capacity.
It isn't clear how 2xAA in the handset are charged at 9.6v by the charger! Somebody like jtr may be able to answer this one.
Stereodude
Not really a
You can get a pretty good deal on it here. (not sure about shipping)
I also like the LaCrosse BC-900 and BC-700.
udaman
Wannabe Storage Freak
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jtr recommended that more than 2x cost 8-cell Maha charger. I suppose the internal construction maybe higher quality, but damn, that's a friggin expensive charger for the simplicity.
So for a 'universal' charger, one that charges aaa, aa, c, d & 9v batteries, for my parents...and possibly myself, I"m going to get in addition to the advanced functionally (but only aa, aaa) Maha 9000 charger:
Titanium Innovations MD-3000 Universal Smart Charger with LCD Display
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=187985
Would be nice if the auto-timer could go 10hrs instead of only 6, but only a few D cells really tax it at present (assuming the battery is fully discharged)... but it charges just fast enough, and with the $50 price difference, that buys a set of C & D LSD cells.
I'm also buying the Rayovac LSD's that are kind of 'hidden' LSD's, which is an economy version of the 'hybrid' labeled cell they sell for more $$$. Only $5.79/4pack. I'll get Sanyo Eneloops for my LED flashlight needs, for max current capability, but for all other Nimh needs, can't beat the price of the "Rayovac 4.0 rechargeable"
So for a 'universal' charger, one that charges aaa, aa, c, d & 9v batteries, for my parents...and possibly myself, I"m going to get in addition to the advanced functionally (but only aa, aaa) Maha 9000 charger:
Titanium Innovations MD-3000 Universal Smart Charger with LCD Display
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=187985
Would be nice if the auto-timer could go 10hrs instead of only 6, but only a few D cells really tax it at present (assuming the battery is fully discharged)... but it charges just fast enough, and with the $50 price difference, that buys a set of C & D LSD cells.
I'm also buying the Rayovac LSD's that are kind of 'hidden' LSD's, which is an economy version of the 'hybrid' labeled cell they sell for more $$$. Only $5.79/4pack. I'll get Sanyo Eneloops for my LED flashlight needs, for max current capability, but for all other Nimh needs, can't beat the price of the "Rayovac 4.0 rechargeable"
paugie
Storage is cool
Somebody took the time to test a few sets of "low self discharge" batteries. He says Eneloops and Powerex were his choices.
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=677074
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=677074
Will Rickards
Storage Is My Life
Not sure if I posted this or not, but my maha charger wouldn't charge in the 3rd slot for some reason one day but it worked the next. Maha replaced it with no real questions. They just sent me a new one and a postage paid return slip. That was awesome.
The new one doesn't make the high pitched noises the old one used to.
But it also won't charge my older maha batteries. It keeps reporting HIGH. Anything I can do to recover these batteries? I can charge them with my old radioshack charger and they work fine.
The new one doesn't make the high pitched noises the old one used to.
But it also won't charge my older maha batteries. It keeps reporting HIGH. Anything I can do to recover these batteries? I can charge them with my old radioshack charger and they work fine.
Stereodude
Not really a
Some people on candlepowerforums have done very detailed comparisons also that show the Eneloops to be the battery of choice.
Pradeep
Storage? I am Storage!
My smoke detectors use two 9V batteries (they provide light when triggered). Seems like an application where disposables are still useful.
Fushigi
Storage Is My Life
Our smoke detectors are wired to the house for power but have 9V battery backups. I like this setup as normally your supposed to replace the 9V batteries twice a year, but these units give a battery alarm when the 9V is low. They're lasting at least 7 years.
The same is true for our alarm clocks in the bedrooms (AC w/battery backup), although with those it seems the 9V only lasts around 2-3 years.
The same is true for our alarm clocks in the bedrooms (AC w/battery backup), although with those it seems the 9V only lasts around 2-3 years.
udaman
Wannabe Storage Freak
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Useful, but overall causing more waste disposal problems.
There are LSD 9v rechargeable...one below should be 8.4V (7 cells @1.2v), though not very high capacity @200ma
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/s...41_477.html?osCsid=a98rm8a91donrsllit8gi3gna7
You'll have to buy an expensive, 4-cell Li-Poly/NiMH 9v only charger ($35); but the 500ma IPower 9v (8.4V) Li-poly should be even longer lasting 'low self-discharge'. Still will cost way more than disposable Lithium 9v.
http://www.thomasdistributing.com/s...html?SP_id=&osCsid=a98rm8a91donrsllit8gi3gna7
udaman
Wannabe Storage Freak
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Cyber2009 code gets u 10% off entire batteryjunction site, today only..until 12/01 midnight I suppose, but who knows with computers 
.
^(don't buy any Fenix flashlights though, don't support a DH like 4Sevens)
I ordered a few Eneloops, for some flashlights jtr is building me/will build me...please. For all other non-high current drain applications for AA rechargeables I"m buying the Chinese made Rayovac LSD AA & AAA. @$1ea, the Eneloops are typically 2.5x as much...too expensive! (no matter what jtr says ).
And then there are the ridiculously overpriced C & D cell LSD NiMH. wtf, $25ea for a D-cell? I need 3 of these D's for a Rayovac 3x3W LED lantern that costs $25. IOW, $75 for batteries on a $25 light that I'd hardly ever use! Makes no sense at all to buy *anything* but alkaline...sorry jtr your argument fails in that scenario, and a ban shouldn't be in effect until cells, or all sizes come down to $1/1A costs, period!
Crap I can buy a D Li-Ion of 5Ah rating for the same cost on DX as one of these D LSD NiMH, they (LSD's) are simply too expensive for what they offer. Same goes for the 200ma LSD NiMH 9v batteries, 2 expensive! For a little more, you can buy a 9V Li-Poly that gives you 2x the capacity...that *is* worth the extra cost. When you want longer runtime, a 500ma 9v Li-Poly is the way to go, but you need to buy yet another friggin charger, unless you have a radio control model charger designed to charge more than one type of cell chemistry, and can balance charge a multicell pack safely.
http://www.batteryjunction.com/rayovac-aa-rf715-4.html
$4/4pack, not as good a performer as the Eneloops, but for more plebeian uses, they will do.
There are now 2032 coin size Li-Ion rechargeable, but none in the other more common size of 2025, still have to go with disposables.
The only disposable I can see mandating banning would be AA & AAA sizes, at present. For the rest, someday in the future perhaps.
So basically the 10% will almost pay for shipping costs.
w00t, my 1st 1k post on any internet site...wow, how did I write so much garbage???
^^^ I feel pretty, oh so pretty, like Sharapova (sorry timwitt, no hot arse Asian babes vids I could think to link)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au17YpGAa-s&feature=related
.^(don't buy any Fenix flashlights though, don't support a DH like 4Sevens)
I ordered a few Eneloops, for some flashlights jtr is building me/will build me...please
. For all other non-high current drain applications for AA rechargeables I"m buying the Chinese made Rayovac LSD AA & AAA. @$1ea, the Eneloops are typically 2.5x as much...too expensive! (no matter what jtr says ).And then there are the ridiculously overpriced C & D cell LSD NiMH. wtf, $25ea for a D-cell? I need 3 of these D's for a Rayovac 3x3W LED lantern that costs $25. IOW, $75 for batteries on a $25 light that I'd hardly ever use! Makes no sense at all to buy *anything* but alkaline...sorry jtr your argument fails in that scenario, and a ban shouldn't be in effect until cells, or all sizes come down to $1/1A costs, period!
Crap I can buy a D Li-Ion of 5Ah rating for the same cost on DX as one of these D LSD NiMH, they (LSD's) are simply too expensive for what they offer. Same goes for the 200ma LSD NiMH 9v batteries, 2 expensive! For a little more, you can buy a 9V Li-Poly that gives you 2x the capacity...that *is* worth the extra cost. When you want longer runtime, a 500ma 9v Li-Poly is the way to go, but you need to buy yet another friggin charger, unless you have a radio control model charger designed to charge more than one type of cell chemistry, and can balance charge a multicell pack safely.
http://www.batteryjunction.com/rayovac-aa-rf715-4.html
$4/4pack, not as good a performer as the Eneloops, but for more plebeian uses, they will do.
There are now 2032 coin size Li-Ion rechargeable, but none in the other more common size of 2025, still have to go with disposables.
The only disposable I can see mandating banning would be AA & AAA sizes, at present. For the rest, someday in the future perhaps.
So basically the 10% will almost pay for shipping costs.
w00t, my 1st 1k post on any internet site...wow, how did I write so much garbage???
^^^ I feel pretty, oh so pretty, like Sharapova (sorry timwitt, no hot arse Asian babes vids I could think to link)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au17YpGAa-s&feature=related
ddrueding
Fixture
Only 14 pounds each...sweet!