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LunarMist

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Anything needing Explorer hangs for 30 seconds or a minute when a network device is not available. I experience that every day. :(

I don't under that stuff Merc mentioned. If it is set up on one computer, can the SSDs be moved to a completely different one and the data on the "array" of three drives still be accessed?
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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Losing hardware doesn't help when I'd be out my workstation for however long it takes for them to get around to replacing it, plus having to fight over whether it was installed correctly in the first place. Which I assure you they will do.

I'd be more than a little out of sorts to lose a $2000 CPU, $500 in RAM and a $700 motherboard + whatever my GPUs are because whatever sealed water cooler decided to piddle out a little coolant.
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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I don't under that stuff Merc mentioned. If it is set up on one computer, can the SSDs be moved to a completely different one and the data on the "array" of three drives still be accessed?

Here's an example:

I have four top level "Pictures" folders.

Pictures\
Photos
Inputs
Internet
Outputs

Photos are personal images that I've downloaded or saved from elsewhere.
Inputs are where SDcards go when they're imported, plus temp folders for TIFFs and other working space.
Internet is just random crap I've saved from the web or something.
Outputs are where things go after they've been processed from Inputs.

Photos and Internet actually live on D:\data\Pictures. And that's fine and good and normal. You can just relocate that folder in Windows in the normal way.
Inputs and Outputs live on their own storage volumes, which I create like this:

mklink -d d:\data\Pictures\Inputs \\?\Volume{some-windows-guid}\Inputs

... using the GUID because I'm too lazy to assign some of my storage its own drive letter.

What this means, from a functional standpoint, is that Outputs sits on a 2TB drive of its own, and Inputs sits on a 4TB RAID0, and both are presented to my desktop as part of the regular Pictures Library, along with the "Pictures" Data folder that sits on my NAS.

There's a process that ensures that anything that's on Outputs gets mirrored on my NAS. The assumption I make about Inputs is that they can be regenerated from the original SD card if I care that much, but I do mirror a potion of it, the "picks" that get imported for editing, as well as the actual Capture One libraries I use, which have their own, separate directory structure.

How does all this work with Libraries?

When I open Pictures, I see the massive list of personal photos that live on my NAS, the personal photos I've saved relatively recently and all the stuff that lives on those two independent volumes (disks). For the most part, between volumes and Libraries, I don't have to think about where my data actually is. I either want to see it all in one place, or I can treat it like it's all the same thing. That's why those things working together are so useful.
 

LunarMist

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I understand you can assign folders to different and multiple places, but what is the RAID 0, a Windows tool or something else?
I have tried the JBOD for multiple drives, but like HDDS, SSDs do not like being nearly full.
 

LunarMist

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Those directory redirectors are why I have my data stored on my NAS and it's seamless. Though Windows does like to freak out a little when I don't have a network connection, so I'm assuming I might have just done something slightly wrong. It's a situation that happens so minimally often that I don't really mind when it does, especially now that I'm working on a project laptop I can daily instead of firing up my main desktop and sucking up 150W at idle just to browse the web. Since my main doesn't really perform any server functions anymore I can get away with only turning it on when I really need it.

Back to the topic at hand, yeah, consumer hardware makes those assumptions and usually they're right. It also, as a bonus, lets them budget-segment the hell out of professional hardware that provides the IO people who actually use it really need. U.2/U.3 is a standard that never really made it into the consumer space because at the sizes consumers use, m.2 was plenty sufficient.

On the subject of cooling, liquid cooling has come a long way since I tossed my MasterLiquid Lite 240 for the pump noise. You can get reasonably safe coolers that barely make any noise at all. The companies that make AIOs typically have warranty programs in place that I believe will replace any hardware you had that would have been killed by a leak, but these days I'm pretty sure they're using something that won't kill your hardware as a coolant anyway. I still personally will never choose to do it again, but if a platform all but requires it, it's no longer a reason for me to not consider that platform anymore.
NAS is fine for bulk storage, but slow for working a drive with lots of reading/writing.

Warranties for liability of anything beyond the defective part are dicey at best. Ask anyone who has tried to make a claim for $100K against their UPS or power strip failing. :(
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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I understand you can assign folders to different and multiple places, but what is the RAID 0, a Windows tool or something else?
I have tried the JBOD for multiple drives, but like HDDS, SSDs do not like being nearly full.

It's a volume I created with the X399 firmware. It doesn't NEED to be RAID0 because it'll never be running so fast that I need 5GB/s+ transfer rates, but I did want the single volume to be large enough to not have to worry about capacity. If that volume craps out, it's not the end of the world; the data all exists in other places or can be easily recreated.
 

sedrosken

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Losing hardware doesn't help when I'd be out my workstation for however long it takes for them to get around to replacing it, plus having to fight over whether it was installed correctly in the first place. Which I assure you they will do.

I'd be more than a little out of sorts to lose a $2000 CPU, $500 in RAM and a $700 motherboard + whatever my GPUs are because whatever sealed water cooler decided to piddle out a little coolant.

Don't get me wrong, I prefer air cooling myself as well, and all else equal I will obviously use it over liquid cooling. I'm just saying that platforms that need it are no longer completely out of the running just because they need it in my mind. Granted, they're usually out of consideration for power concerns long before you reach the point where liquid cooling makes sense.
 

LunarMist

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It's a volume I created with the X399 firmware. It doesn't NEED to be RAID0 because it'll never be running so fast that I need 5GB/s+ transfer rates, but I did want the single volume to be large enough to not have to worry about capacity. If that volume craps out, it's not the end of the world; the data all exists in other places or can be easily recreated.
It must be RAID 0, JBOD, or individual no? I'm trying to understand where all those bytes go. What you don't want is one drive filling up while the others are mostly empty. You barely get 1500 MB/sec. with a decent M.2 drive after the SLC buffer is filled and worse when it is close to full.
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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The impact of it being JBOD or RAID0 is functionally the same. I just used the hardware to make a volume instead of using storage spaces or LVM within the OS in order to have a large enough space to work in. I wouldn't have bothered if 4TB consumer drives were affordable.
 

LunarMist

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I'm thinking of building a system with the 7950x if possible, but the RAMs are confusing. I can live with 64GB for now. Is it correct that four modules are worse than two in speed due to some BS with the chipset? Which RAMs will work with the AMD and be best in 32x2GB configuration?
 

sedrosken

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From what I understand the issue with more than two DDR5 modules on AM5 is more a latency thing and isn't even that big a deal, but if it's important to you then definitely work around it. I haven't heard anything about RAM incompatibilities like early 1st-gen Ryzen where you essentially used Samsung B-die or nothing, so use what's the best deal from a reputable manufacturer on your end, I don't think it matters.
 

sedrosken

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Okay, I was very wrong. Apparently for everything after 2 dual-rank DIMMs the max clock (not latency) goes down to 3600. Not great especially since Zen4 still uses the DRAM clock to derive infinity fabric speeds so you definitely want 5200MHz or better on the DRAM.
 

LunarMist

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Are 32GB modules always of 2nd rank design? I was hoping to have 128GB sometime in my life, but this latest performance failure by the AMD is not conducive. OTOH, Intel sucks too much power for airy coolers.

I cannot find anything on the AMD site for which RAM is the baseline frequency. 4800 seems to the standard for 32GB modules, but the 16GB are 5200 or even 6000. However, 4x16 will suck even more than 4800 due to the crappy chipsets. Most "tech" websites only care about slaughter games and use minimal amounts of RAM. The pros are all buying Macs (no RAM allowed). It was a lot easier years ago with DDR4 and others before then.
 

Mercutio

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There are purportedly real benefits in holding out for higher bandwidth RAM on AMD's architecture. I have DDR4 3600 CL18 RAM in my workstation and I've never used anything else with it. I believe DDR5-7200 is the highest speed RAM currently approved by JEDEC, so that's probably the stuff you're looking for on your next AMD system. The RAM itself is different, but you're getting the workstationy goodness of ECC out of it, which is probably worth the a minute trade-off in latency anyway.

If nothing else, remember that you'll be able to double or quadruple your RAM over the life of your system. Buying that Mac Studio means a $6000 computer and learning to love external drives and shoving most of the storage on some giant, stupid NAS.
 

LunarMist

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I'm not seeing any 32GB actually qualified very high. It seems most are 4000 or 4800 SPD and OC to 5600 with Intel XMP. With four modules they are slower. Very few support the EXPO, which apparently is needed (AMD doesn't like XMP?). The X670E mainboards indicate 128GB max (4x slow modules), so how am I going to have more RAM in the future?
 

LunarMist

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Most of my storage is on several giant NAS. ;)
In order to minimize the effort and costs, I may just add another 2TB M.2 and run 3x2 TB in RIAD 0 as WIP storage since the X670E boards have four M.2 slots.
 
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