Wireless Router & cards

[time]

ddrueding said: If reliability/stability is paramount, to me there is no question.

WRT54GL/WUSB54GS

ddrueding said:WRT54G and WAP54G are both great products. I've used a LOT of them and do have about 10-15% fail within 2 years. They are a cheap commodity prduct, what more do you want?



BTW, quoting is broken, Doug.

 

[Howell]

Any improvements appear to be due to spatial multiplexing, i.e. multiple antennas - something I don't believe you'll see on consumer-level devices at this point in time.

Is the Linksys WRT54GX2 not consumer-level?

 

[Mercutio]

How are your failure rates for WRT54Gs so low?
Mine easily quadruple that.

 

[e_dawg]

I personally use and like the WRT54G. While the unit itself doesn't fail in that it doesn't die, it does need to be hard reset a couple times a year when wireless clients cannot connect to it at all. That's a PITA when you have to re-enter all the settings, especially the whitelist for the MAC addresses and HEX WEP/WPA keys.

 

[Mercutio]

I have a lot of 'em that either stop doing wireless or have the WAN port die, hard reset or no.

 

[sechs]

Merc, are you using the newer model WRT54Gs without Linux?

I've been using a WRT54GL for about two years now, and the only problem I have is the need to reboot it every few months. The issue seems to stem from the third-party firmware that I use, and not anything with the hardware.

It's an acceptable trade-off for me in consideration of the additional features that I get from the firmware.

 

[Mercutio]

I use the standard firmware on APs that someone might call for support on.

 

[sechs]

I ask because the ones running Linux seem to have more robust hardware than the ones running Vxware. If you're getting the latter, then it may explain the issues.

 

[Mercutio]

I've had long term issues with Linksys APs and routers. I had the same problems with the older ones as the new. The problems I've had with 'em go back years at this point.
Unfortunately, nothing else works as well and is as cheap and as available as those WRT54Gs.

 

[ddrueding]

The "GL" version is the linux-based model; sporting more memory and a faster CPU (IIRC). This is the one all the aftermarket firmwares are written for. Even if you were going to keep the original firmware, I'd get the beefier model.

 

[time]

The "GL" version is the linux-based model; sporting more memory and a faster CPU (IIRC) ... Even if you were going to keep the original firmware, I'd get the beefier model.

They're nominally the same chipset, but the VxWare image is half the size and needs only half the RAM of the obviously bloated Linux firmware (compared to other brands). It's easy to see why Linksys made the change.

The GL was never faster than the G of the same vintage. In fact, the CPU in the latest G and GS models is 20% faster than in the GL.

 

[time]

Is the Linksys WRT54GX2 not consumer-level?

This isn't spatial multiplexing. You need two or more antenna at each end for that, so start looking for MIMO dual-antenna network cards.

Also, I notice that the model you referred to demonstrated exceptionally poor long range performance in a CNET test.

 

[Mercutio]

Grr.

One of my VIP customers just had their third, *THIRD* WRT54G this year die. I walked him through resetting it and connecting a different PC and resetting his Internet service and everything else.

Nope. It just doesn't want to route any more. It still switches and APs, but those things aren't much fun without the internet.

For as much as I like them when they work, I hate those things when they die. Hate. Hate. Hate.

 

[MaxBurn]

Third one this year? Is it on battery backed / conditioned power with surge suppressor for the incoming WAN?

 

[mubs]

Sorry Merc

I think I'll go with the Buffalo. They even have an office in India and sell these same models there, so I hopefully will have some service in case of a problem. I've been holding off buying a bunch of stuff waiting for Memorial Day prices, but so far have been disappointed.

 

[Mercutio]

Third one this year? Is it on battery backed / conditioned power with surge suppressor for the incoming WAN?

Yeah, everything's running through a nice-ish home UPS setup.
I can't be the only person who has problems with those things, can I?

 

[ddrueding]

I have a bunch of them in the field, some with aftermarket firmware and the transmit power turned way up. I might remember having one die once, but I haven't seen an epidemic.

 

[Sol]

My parents Linksys router died the other day... I don't remember what model it was but it wasn't a WRT54G... Still dead is dead and spending almost 3 hours on the phone helping them to configure voip on the replacement router only to have it work only intermittently was painful...

I generally don't trust any consumer grade routers not to fail, they all seem pretty flaky in the long run...

 

[MaxBurn]

Been using my 3Com wireless gateway for about five years now I think, the part number is huge so let me know if you want it. Part of their SOHO line I think.

 

[time]

So, have we come to a consensus that all consumer-level wireless routers suck, or is there a sensible recommendation?

I want to replace a customer's two-year-old Netgear WR614; it appears to have become flaky with DHCP over wireless - I think. :roll:

It has to go through at least three double brick walls (!), so wireless range performance is the key. I don't think Linksys is a possibility - Merc used to be a fan, and I definitely couldn't tolerate anywhere near those kind of failure rates.

AFAICT, the only reasonable way to boost range is to have a better antenna. MIMO stuff only works its magic with compatible gear, which is useless in 99.9% of applications. And boosting the transmission power of one end only is obviously pretty half-baked.

Any practical thoughts? Mubs, do you have any feedback yet after your planned purchase?

 

[ddrueding]

I flash WRT54Gs with aftermarket firmware that is supposed to double power output, than I add the larger 7dBi antennas. With this config I can get to the other side of a downtown block or across the street 2 floors up.

 

[Fushigi]

I can understand how these have the power to go longer distances but I wonder how our measily laptops can talk back.

My house is somewhere in this pic. The circles are the MetroFi WAPs. I'm about a block form the nearest WAP and have a 2 of 5 bar signal strength.

 

[ddrueding]

MetroFi around here offers spiffy WiFi repeaters...something to think about.

 

[mubs]

Mubs, do you have any feedback yet after your planned purchase?

I bought a Buffalo WHR-HP-G54 router and two Buffalo WLI-TX4-G54HP Ethernet Converters. They are matched MIMO devices. I haven't tested them yet; can only do that once I get home (India). The earliest I could post feedback would be mid-July.

If you see my original post (that started this thread), I wanted something that would work through brick walls. After reading reviews on performance and reliability, Buffalo was my choice. Time (no, not you :-D) will tell if my choice was wise.

 

[timwhit]

I haven't tested them yet; can only do that once I get home (India).

Are you originally from India?

 

[mubs]

Born there, raised there, worked there for 5 years, then lived/worked in Calif. for 22 years then moved back there May 2006. Would that qualify as the shortest autobio ever?:king:

 

[timwhit]

Short, but to the point. What part of India?

 

[mubs]

Pre-US, Chennai (then known as Madras). Now in Bangalore (outsourcing hub). The company I'm consulting for bought a couple of companies in the U.S., including one in Orange County, CA - where I lived all of the 22 years. Talk about weird coincidences!

I work out of my home in Bangalore now, but I'll be going perm soon, and early next year will have to move to Chennai - their India HQ.

Nature of my work will mean I'll be coming to CA (U.S. HQ) frequently, though.

 

[timwhit]

One of the java developers on my team is originally from Chennai.

Are you happy to be back in India after such a long time in the US? It's got to be quite a change.

That flight has got to be torture. The longest flight I have been on was around 9 hours and I was ready to kill by the end. Coincidentally, it was on Air India between London and Chicago. To put it lightly, it wasn't the best service I have encountered. But, it was cheap.

 

[mubs]

Happy? Yup. After moving there last year, and being there for 10 months, I was back here in March. That was a test -- how would I feel? It felt great for 2 days, then I was absolutely sure I didn't want to live in the U.S. permanently again. There's something in India, intangible, that is missing here. It's something one feels inside, at an unspoken level.

It wasn't a bad change for me or the missus; we both moved here as adults. Was a bit hard on my kid who was born and raised in CA. But in about 6 months, she was happy as a clam. She has more friends there than she ever had here, has a childhood (which she didn't here for various reasons), and has tons of cousins and relatives (all of the missus' side, most of mine). So it's worked out really well.

I have never flown Air India; they're known for shoddy service and for abandoning passengers when things go wrong. We've always flown Malaysian Air or Singapore Air (the best IMO - superb service, every plane < 5 years old).

Total time in the air is ~ 24 hours. Longest leg is Los Angeles to Kuala Lumpur or Singapore, which is ~ 20 hours, but there is a refuelling halt on the way - usually Taipei, which is ~ 14 hours from Los Angeles. KL/Singapore to Chennai/Bangalore is about 3.5 hours. There is usually a layover in KL or Singapore of 8-10 hours going from LAX to India, but only an hour or two flying the other way. Head/Tail winds will add or subtract 2-3 hours between the U.S. and SE Asia. One way you have headwinds, the other tailwinds, can't remember which occurs going which way. Fairly turbulent over Taiwan. On my way into the U.S. this time, we hit a really nasty air pocket; we must have dropped for a continuous 3-4 seconds.

Flights to - from India and SE Asia depart at night. Flying to the U.S., one leaves India at night and arrives at LAX the next day midday :-D, thanks to crossing the dateline (you gain a day). Going from LAX to India, you'd leave on say, Friday night, and be in India Sunday night (you lose a day).

I've already done 1.5 trips this year; I'll be doing at least three round trips in 2007 ; one eventually learns to deal with the long hours.

 

[mubs]

Back OT:

I finally set up the router as an AP, along with one Ethernet Converter (hub) client. Set up was super easy - no sw to load, just change the AP IP address to suit my network. The Router/AP and Ethernet hub client both have a button on top; you first press the button on the router AP, and when it's ready, do the same for the Ethernet hub client. When you do this, they talk to each other and set themselves up for maximum speed and security (best case is AES, which they configured themselves to in my case)

I am typing this on the laptop, connected to the Ethernet hub client. I also have the Linksys Vonage VoIP adapter plugged into the same Ethernet hub client. I was worried voice quality might be bad, but it's flawless!

My laptop's wireless NIC sees a "secured" wireless network that requires a key to connect to.

I did a speed test at 2wire.com on my lappy, and it said the speed was 1.5 Mbps.

I'm happy with my Buffalo wireless router/clients purchase.