Annual Upgrade

[LunarMist]

Usyually Q4 is the time to upgrade the main system, but this year I don't know what to do. I have an old system, P4 3.2@3.4, 4GB PC 3200, 15k.3 boot drive, whole bunch of IDE storage, etc. Of course I could use a performance boost, but it seems that the speed gains are diminishing in the last two years. It also seems like everything I have will obsolete with SATA and this PCI-E stuff taking over. Should I just sit around and wait, and if so how long?

 

[ddrueding]

As far as the "big picture" and upgrading, I don't see a major step coming until desktop-class systems are able to exceed 4GB of RAM. Until then, masses of CPU power and evolutionary and 15k RPM drives are stagnant.

 

[Pradeep]

Just forget about upgrading the PC and get yourself a 1DsMKII. We got one in yesterday and it is fantastic. The resolving power is mindboggling, and the transfer speed over firewire is thankfully much improved over the slothy Mk1. Biggest problem is finding a lens that doesn't look like shite when connected to it

 

[Pradeep]

I have to agree regarding CPU speed, I guess with Intel running out of huff and puff, AMD is now the one that has less pressure to quickly ramp speeds. We will prob see a plateau for a while, at least till they both get their multi-core CPUs out.

DD, do you think <4GB in a desktop class system is a big limitation? When I think desktop I'm thinking of people running email, Net, Word, that kind of thing. They prob haven't even reached the heady heights of 1GB. Plus ram prices are a little high nowadays.

 

[LunarMist]

Just forget about upgrading the PC and get yourself a 1DsMKII. We got one in yesterday and it is fantastic. The resolving power is mindboggling, and the transfer speed over firewire is thankfully much improved over the slothy Mk1. Biggest problem is finding a lens that doesn't look like shite when connected to it

Yeah, yeah, I know. I f*cked up big time in trusting a local dealer. Anyway, I don't have a body and will be travleling during the second consignment, and then it will be winter, so I may as well wait until spring. The main problem now is to get rid of the 1D MK II. I'm still keeping the 1Ds as a backup. I know the L zooms don't cut it for best image quality, especially in the edges and corners. I'll probably have to get a few more primes, first the 35/1.4, then probably the 135/2. One would hope that the macros at least look decent, but you are scaring me. I'm pretty confident that the 300/2.8 IS and 500/4 IS will look fine.

 

[Pradeep]

I'm sure they will be fine. We use a horrific 28-200mm zoom on ours. We have a minimum focus distance limitation tho, around 36"

 

[ddrueding]

I agree that 90% of users don't need to break the 1GB barrier any time soon. When regular users ask me what machine to get, I say "The cheapest Dell you can get with a DVD burner and the nicest monitor you can afford". I haven't had a complaint yet.

What I mean by "desktop motherboard" is basically anything with a single CPU, onboard NIC and sound, at a reasonable price. A nForce3 250Gb with 8 DIMM slots would make me happy, as many of my Photoshop /AutoCAD/ Maya/ Soundforge friends just want more RAM.

 

[LunarMist]

I think it will still be a couple of years before 64-bot Windows and applications are available and more RAM is usable. If I can't get some good improvement now without high expense, would it make more sense to build another PC to do some work in parallel?

 

[Handruin]

Would a dual CPU setup help you? You might be able to build a dual Xeon or Opteron. You could try to run two tasks at the same time, possibly to two separate drives. Two machines might be faster, but need to have the space. What kind of work are you trying to accomplish that you need a faster machine than a 3.2 GHz P4?

 

[Tea]

If you can't find a better machine than a cheap Dell, you're not looking.

 

[P5-133XL]

I would love a 1Ds Mk-2 but they are still too spendy for me. I'm still stuck with my EOS-3. Anything digital, that is affordable, I feal as a step down. I guess that I'm just plain stuck in the mud.

I agree that computer upgrades are much less of a requirement than they used to be: real performance improvement has been negligable for quite a while now. Once you get to 2.5+GHz; 1GB RAM; the only real necessary upgrades, for most, are video or sound necessary for gaming. Those don't typically require computer replacement.

Even dual-cores are expected to only deliver a 30% speed increase for the first year (They lower the clock rates to limit heat production); 64-bit will change the upgrade needs but not untill the 64-bit OS is the norm and that is a while away yet.

Conclusion - Save your money, unless there is a specific need that justifies your purchase.

 

[LunarMist]

Mark,

The EOS3 is a nice body, though I would have gladly traded a diopter for the flakey eye-control AF selection. The plastic body always made me nervous. I still have one with a 70-200/2.8 L in the back of the closet somewhere. I have not used either for over three years.

The 1Ds is fine for most purposes and the used prices are dropping rapidly.

Doug,

The dual CPU machines tend to create sticker shock, especially since I don't know how much they can be upgraded. Are there any setups that could utilize my current 4x1GB unbuffered PC3200?

 

[Pradeep]

AFAIK all the dual setups require registered DDR, if not ECC as well.

 

[Gilbo]

Some Intel dual boards actually don't need registered RAM. The ones that use the i875P Intel chipset, in particular, are good value for the money. The Asus PC-DL, NCCH-DL and the IWill DH800 will all allow you to build a dual Intel system quite inexpensively. The latter two will also support the newer Nocona CPUs (although the DH800 needs a recent BIOS), which you may or may not want depending on whether your house has air conditioning or not.

Personally though, I agree with people advising you not to spend money on computer hardware right now. You simply won't achieve much for your money if you have a remotely modern system --which you do.

 

[CougTek]

If you have the money and you really want something faster, an Appro 1142H doesn't seem like a bad system.

 

[LunarMist]

Well, I think that a qUad CPU system is is out my price range. I only have a $5K annual personal computer budget.

 

[Adcadet]

LCD monitor? Spiffy new keyboard or mouse? Speakers? Nice headphones (love my Senn HD 280s!)? I figure these things tend to last years, and the tech may not be advancing that quickly so they'll be useful for years. Plus, these are the things that let you interface with your computer (unless you have one of the new USB3.0 ports in your thalamus).

 

[LunarMist]

USB 3.0? I am not familiar with that. I purchased a new mouse recently, a classic 1.1A PS/2 wheel Intellimouse. I don't have any speakers at all, only a cheap pair of headphones. Since I don't play the computer video games, audio is rarely used. I keep buying the same basic keyboards every couple of years. They don;t break, but they are not worth cleaning either. Any yes, I could buy a better display, but I am kinda lazy and calibration is a hassle. It seems that the options in quality CRTs are dwindling and the LCDs still don't look quite right.

 

[Adcadet]

USB 3.0? I am not familiar with that.

If you look closely, you'll see the USB3.0 port between VPL, LP, and pulvinar.

 

[LunarMist]

So will I look like Vernon Wells?

 

[LunarMist]

Just forget about upgrading the PC and get yourself a 1DsMKII.

Done! But now my PC seems slower than ever. RAW conversion times are around 19 seconds per frame.

 

[Pradeep]

Ouch! We shoot in JPEG, only use RAW for white balance setting etc. Next week I can compare performance of a Nocona 2.8 to an Athlon 64 at hopefully 2.4GHz.

 

[LunarMist]

Are you using DPP 1.5? Even worse, the subnotebook with 900MHz Pentium M ULV takes 39 seconds. :eekers: At least the 100% preview is much faster than with the older DPP and the horrid FVU/EVU.

 

[Gilbo]

Just forget about upgrading the PC and get yourself a 1DsMKII.

Done! But now my PC seems slower than ever. RAW conversion times are around 19 seconds per frame.

16.6MP, 16-bit RAW images will do that to you . They're 91.5MB aren't they? Consider yourself lucky. I'm going to be enjoying my S2 Pro for several more years in all likelihood. I'm beginning to think I should have stuck with my trusty Nikon F-401s until development on these digis slows down.

If it's something you're serious about spending money on, and you're willing to overclock, I'd really recommend taking a look at an i875P-based dual-Xeon system. You could put the basics together for under US$1000 (mobo, 2 Xeons, RAM). Most 2.4Ghz Xeons boot at 3.6Ghz at the 800Mhz FSB that those boards support. See my post earlier in this thread for your mobo options. Even though most RAW conversion applications (all?) aren't multithreaded, you can easily run two sessions at a time. Of course you could probably build two cheap A64 boxes for that price. Hmm.

Considering the slow pace of processor development, if you want to speed things up, then you're pretty much doomed to trying to parallelize the process in one way or another.

Incidentally,
Has anyone seen benchmarks on Apple's G5 RAW conversion performance? Those PPC 970s have an architecture that seems like it would be well-suited to RAW conversion (lots of registers, execution units, and Altivec...). I suppose it depends on how much optimization work has been done.

 

[LunarMist]

The RAW conversion times were with only 8-bit files. In any case, I will have no budget for upgrades anytime soon. I need to buy a 500/4 IS and a 20D as well within the next month.

 

[Pradeep]

Are you using DPP 1.5? Even worse, the subnotebook with 900MHz Pentium M ULV takes 39 seconds. :eekers: At least the 100% preview is much faster than with the older DPP and the horrid FVU/EVU.

Only thing I use is EVU to set white balance, otherwise just EOS Capture to tell it where to save the images.