Mech keyboards

[Handruin]

One's where you install switches with stronger tension. I've mentioned multiple times earlier in this thread what I like but no idea if that interests you.

 

[Santilli]

I looked through all H's recommendations. Problem is none of them are much different from the Cherry reds. 40G vs. 60g isn't worth buying a new board.
Not when I've got two buckling springs I havent used, and, I can't find decent switches like Kalih Navy box ...

 

[Santilli]

One's where you install switches with stronger tension. I've mentioned multiple times earlier in this thread what I like but no idea if that interests you.

this one looks pretty good, but, heavy switches?
They have a bunch, but none really heavy.

 

[Santilli]

https://drop.com/mechanical-keyboards/drops?sc=keyboards&tgs=full-size%2Cfully-built-keyboards%2Ctkl

 

[Santilli]

Still, no Navy Blue keys...

 

[Santilli]

Still, no Navy Blue keys...

Anyone have another key that is as heavy as the Navy Blues??

 

[Handruin]

I guess I'm a bit confused. Are you looking for just the switches or a complete keyboard with your desired switches?

I don't know what the navy blue switches you're referring to or what weight/tension you're interested in

 

[Santilli]

I spilled wine on Corsair. New lighted buckling spring keyboard. Can't post it.
Unicomp M with a usb light over it. Best way to get a lighted, buckling spring keyboard.

 

[Santilli]

I guess I'm a bit confused. Are you looking for just the switches or a complete keyboard with your desired switches?

I don't know what the navy blue switches you're referring to or what weight/tension you're interested in

I was hoping to find a 96-100% full sized, with heavy keys, similar to the buckling spring Model M I'm typing on. I would like a backlit keyboard with heavy switches, that are similar to the buckling spring keyboards, but maybe a little quieter.
Wired is good. Am I forgetting anything? Lubed would be good, too. The model M feels a little scratchy.

 

[sedrosken]

Amazon has wholesale sets of so many Kailh BOX switches -- I think they're genuine, there's a link to visit the Kailh store on the listing -- I got a box of 110 BOX Navy switches to replace the Gateron Reds on my K4 Pro with as I'm tired of fat fingering every switch and no longer care about making noise, and with a 10% off coupon, I paid about 45 bucks for it. I also grabbed a set of cheap pudding doubleshot PBT caps to show the backlighting through the lettering as I'm really tired of these front shine-through ones, they're difficult to read. I figure at 13 bucks if they suck I don't miss out on much, and the lettering is clear and not gamer-y which I like, though usually I prefer SA or DSA profile caps these say they're "XDA profile" whatever that means. I can't find what I did with my old DSA kit, and this will tide me over until I can find them I guess.

 

[Santilli]

Hi Sedrosken
Would you give me a link to the cap set you picked up? I'm looking for extra large letters, that allow plenty of light through, and fit the Kailh Navy box switches.
Haven't figure out what keyboard to use yet. Want something that allows me to print screen, unlike this one:

Keychron K4 Bluetooth Wireless Mechanical Keyboard RGB LED Backlit, Hot-swappable Compact 100 Keys USB Wired Computer Gaming Keyboard Aluminum Frame for Mac Windows, Gateron Blue Switch​

 

[sedrosken]

My caps don't have a large legend. They wouldn't suit your needs.

 

[Santilli]

Narrowed it down a bit. 96-100%
Brass plate
hot swap switches
needs to have back lighting
Porcelin Key caps?
North facing

as far as I"ve got. The more I look, the more questions I have.

 

[Santilli]

Hi Gregory, We've got some good news! All of the items from order 264170 have now been shipped:​ ​ Canopus Shine-through - Black / Halo V2 / Field HE / Gem​ Quantity: 1 — Total: $24.00 NuPhy Halo96 V2 - Ionic White / Lemon (55gf) / Black Oak (+$34)​ Quantity: 1 — Total: $173.95 Trying Handruins' ideas?

 

[Santilli]

 

[Santilli]

View attachment 1715

Ordered on 2/3 hasn't shipped yet..

 

[Santilli]

New Model M review:
I've had this for awhile, and finally got it out.

Unicomp GA LLC: New Model M

I think I paid about 120.00 Bidenomics strikes again.
The keyboard is beautiful. I love the white keys on a black background. Great when typing in dim light. Use aUSB light, when the screen is dim.
It's much like the old IBM boards, noisy, clacky and takes a bit more force then the Corsair I've been using with Cherry red keys.
I like the size. I'm wondering if the keys are going to smooth out, and be less scratchy? Seems they are.
Control key doesn't feel right. A little sticky, but that may get better with use.
Overall, it's a high quality keyboard, a bit noisy, and takes a bit of effort too get the keys to work.
Much like what it's made from, the old IBM keyboards. Neat keyboard if you like a heavy, IBM style board, but a bit smaller.

New Model M​

The New Model M buckling spring keyboard has the same mechanism, feel and layout as the original IBM Model M keyboard, but with a slightly smaller footprint. With the much-loved buckling spring key design these keyboards have been prized by computer enthusiasts and robust typists because of the tactile and auditory feedback of each keystroke.

Manufactured in Lexington, Kentucky, our buckling spring keyboard is a heavy, audible keyboard with a gorgeous finish and solid feel reminiscent of the classic IBM Model M keyboard.

Buckling Springs
Buckling springs originated in IBM’s mechanical keyboard as a fundamentally different kind of switch mechanism. Featuring a coil spring that sits between the keycap and a pivoting hammer that collapses when clicked, the spring provides a loud, tactile feedback.

Model M-Inspired Keycaps
The two-tone white and gray buckling spring keys are made of PBT polymer. The dye-sublimated legends compliment the authentic feel and classic design. The keys are also available in all gray or all white.

Specs

• Connection : USB or PS/2
• Cable length : 6 ft.
• Number of keys/buttons : 104
• Length : 17.9 in (455 mm)
• Depth : 7.5 in (180 mm)
• Height : 1.96 in (50 mm)
• Weight : 3 lb 11 oz
• Compatible : PC
• Gross Weight : 6 lbs
• Manufactured in Kentucky

 

[sedrosken]

How legible are the legends on those caps? Last I heard they were still using the old Lexmark equipment for their Model M caps and the lettering had really started to fuzz out since their lines hadn't been re-tooled since the 90s. That was one of the main things keeping me from buying one of their new Model Ms -- that and they insisted on still manufacturing them with 2-key rollover instead of full N-key. It's not 1988 anymore, I can hit more than 3 or 4 keys at a time just with one hand when I'm in a game. Do these "new" models have NKRO?

It's interesting that you mention the keys feel scratchy -- that's a problem I have with unlubed linear switches, and those are made far more cheaply than a buckling spring mechanism. That it's happening here is a little alarming. I wonder how much their line equipment has aged and broken down?

120 sounds about right for a keyboard like this, if it was a little better QC'd anyway. My K4 Pro cost me about a hundred and I put another 30 bucks into reswitching it and reused my old caps from my previous board that were 60 bucks. The craft mechanical keyboard hobby is just rather expensive, it's why I'm glad I got what I wanted and got out.

All I'm going to say is, by the time a couple years pass, you'll be wishing for the old days of Bidenomics. If we put in a 100% tariff on Taiwan like I've heard Trump wants to do, it's basically going to freeze us in time technologically, perhaps forever if China takes them as a signal that we won't defend them from invasion and they, best case, go scorched earth with their own foundries. It could take decades to recover, if we ever do.

 

[Santilli]

Keys look very clean and clear. I'll take some pictures later.

 

[Santilli]

I really doubt these have NKRO. I get the feeling with both my unicomps, that they are made as if it was 1990, hence my old model M power cable pulling off the keyboard, with hardly and stress on it. Major problem, when newer keyboards have major reinforcement in that area, to prevent such problems.
When typing, the keys are quite clear. Black on white, clearly printed, and large enough so even with a black screen, I can see the numbers and symbols, my major weakness as a typist.
It's odd but the force required does sometimes make me miss keys, because I'm used to the super light cherry reds on the Corsair. I miss because I don't hit through, or hard enough, and the key doesn't register.

 

[Santilli]

Bidenomics cut the value of my social security by at least 60% in 4 years.
It's going to take Trump's actions awhile to lower costs. You can't drill, and ship oil instantly.
Trump has a history of threatening tariffs to leverage and get what he really wants.
Trumps' inflation was 1/4th per year the cost of living increase on my Social Security.

 

[sedrosken]

If anyone even wants to buy our oil by the time he's done alienating all of our allies.

 

[jtr1962]

Oil is yesterday's news. The country should be moving towards renewables. How did Trump's attempt to revive the coal industry in his first term go? Coal isn't economically viable any more. Oil won't be within a decade, either. Drilling new wells is a huge investment which oil companies won't make if the extra oil on the market causes a price drop. They'll only drill during periods of sustained, growing demand. That's not happening since we're past peak oil.

This is the most backwards-looking administration in my lifetime. The only drilling which should be done is into his head to give him a lobotomy.

 

[Santilli]

Funny. Gas is the only viable way to cheaply transport products in the US, period.
Unless we come up with an incredible new, lightweight battery technology, it's going to stay that way.
The weight of the batteries, and the charging time, make it a prohibitive expense to add to production costs.
Not to mention the extreme cost currently of electric cars, and living in Kalifornia, the absurd taxes, and monopolies on electricity production.
PG&E and SDGE are making absurd profits. Our current electricity bill is 500-600 a month for a two bedroom apartment, in SAN DIEGO.

 

[jtr1962]

China is making $10K EVs. If Trump removed the tariffs and allowed them to be imported they would sell like hotcakes.

The major reason we're having trouble electrifying is our insistence on clinging to ridiculously sized vehicles which need 3 to 5 times the battery and electricity to go any distance compared to smaller, aerodynamic sedans. Also, car dependency is a huge problem. The best electric vehicle is an electric train, not an electric car, and they've been around since the early 20th century. Unfortunately we just got a party in power which hates public transit. Trump even wants to get rid of the bike lanes in NYC. I guess if you never exercise like him you don't see the need for them.

E-bikes are another good alternative for getting around cities. But we need forward looking government to promote all these things. Only good news is at the rate he's going is we may well end up with a veto-proof Democratic majority in Congress in 2026. Last I checked he hasn't done anything about grocery prices, either.

Electric rates are ridiculous in NYC also. I'm very conservative and still the bills average about $200 a month. On average I use under 500 kW/hr per month. Solar panels are in my near future. I understand that's not viable if you're in an apartment. I turn off the heat after February because oil is too expensive. Long term I want to go to a geothermal heat pump powered by solar panels.

These problems are too big for individuals like us to fix. We need people in charge who will transition us to clean, less expensive energy.

 

[ArAfGo]

When the vocabulary "clean" is used in relation to energy I have to ask whether the individual that wishes to be honest about using the word "clean" --- as in where the special raw material is coming from to make all that fancy "clean" energy stuff --- is that aspect of the overall picture included in that determination a given tool/product is clean?

Then there is the question that arises when a given electric piece of equipment was identified as "clean" is finished. You know, no good. How "clean" is 'getting rid' of that piece of equipment?

I also wonder if folks truly understand how much of the fossil fuels are not used for fuel, but are used to manufacture so many, many everyday products we use. Even cosmetics and food things.

The oil industry is one super complicated industry and just throwing around that vocabulary "clean" or "green" just doesn't cut it if you are serious about understanding the industry. Same with natural gas.

It is good politics to try and pretend all that complicated stuff in that industry can be covered in summary by just using those words "clean" and "green" but when you study the situation with a sincere desire to understand you quickly learn it is one tough topic --- kind of like what the docs say about my spine --- it's like spaghetti --- trying to understand all those industries in all this stuff is like spaghetti.

I think one of you wrote something in another post on another topic; if you are trying to just stick it on a bumper sticker, you aren't serious. To truly understand you have hours and hours of study to do. No, days and days. Weeks and weeks. It really is super complicated. Get wars stopped and you'll be doing some great clean/green stuff for the planet. Help create a planet where humans don't need all those fighter jets and tanks and APCs and more and more of all those other military support vehicles and you'll be doing some great clean/green actions to achieve some good.

 

[ArAfGo]

Unfortunately we just got a party in power which hates public transit.

Do you mind if I toss out the political thought process and ask a question? How many of those folks that are so heavy-duty-cool at making speeches about "clean" and "green" have ditched having a personal vehicle? How many of those super high profile folks that are supposed to have influence on the average citizen have two private vehicles? How many of them fly on special charter flights? Or have their own aircraft?

As I think I wrote in another thread, we average folks can kick butt on ANY issue, if we do it correctly. To heck with those political high profile folks. You want to get something done, then DO IT!

 

[Santilli]

The tech guy doesn't even have the right tools at his work place to OPEN the Model M. He's going to bring if from home...

 

[ArAfGo]

If anyone even wants to buy our oil by the time he's done alienating all of our allies.

I got too carried away with those other posts the last time I was able to focus on this topic and had wanted to focus on your post, sedrosken, but maybe ran out of time or something. Point is, I'm a tad late on this one.

You see, the big production as of late is that fracking stuff, but that oil can't be refined by the old U.S. refineries and so it has to go out of the country to places that built the proper equipment to refine that oil. Well, I did a serious study of all this during a six-month chemo in-patient period and had a work station set up at the hospital and was pretty much confined to bed and so had time to dig deep into all this oil stuff.

Another thing I remember is that the North American continent has a whole bunch of oil and natural gas and so when countries like mainland China get all busy, busy with new money in the hands of people who want cars and all the other reasons the given nation needs fossil fuels; those nations without natural resources of that kind have to eventually purchase from the U.S. or Canada, whether they like it or not. And if drilling and pulling that stuff out of the Earth starts up again here then prices per barrel start to drop. The Middle East nations are slowly losing control over prices like they had back when I remember that sudden surge in prices about the mid-70s (maybe). I remember when I was a kid a gallon of gas was like way-way down to maybe 25 cents or so a gallon.

And I think the Nordic nations are also drilling new wells, yes? That brings down prices. Then the Russian Federation will do better after they stop that darn war stuff they are into. Overriding point is that there just isn't going to be a sudden drop in the need for those fossil fuels as nations start to get extra earning money as they settle down and stop bickering and fighting amongst themselves and others. Peaceful societies allow folks to have money and then they will want stuff that absolutely relies on those fossil fuels. And there are a whole bunch of markets ready to open up when all that stupid fighting stuff stops.

Point is, our oil and natural gas will sell out around the planet, if we so wish. Have you ever looked at the numbers? How much of that oil stuff is going to nations that don't have their own fossil fuel resources? Like right here where I live; Japan? When Fukushima Daiichi went all messed up and there were other energy related troubles here in Japan because of that earthquake and tsunami, we had rolling blackouts that were a real pain for about three or four months. That tsunami knocked out unloading of fuel at some locations, on top of the loss of nuke plants that created electricity.

Any number of troubles we don't usually think about could cause a serious disruption of the fossil fuel supply chain and what a mess that would cause.

I'm afraid I am repeating myself, but it sounds so cool to talk about electric this and that and wind power here and there and all that fancy stuff; but that is what it really is, just fancy talk. Humans are greedy and when they can afford it they want that power that all those nuke/gas/oil plants kick out. They want their cars. They want all sorts of extra stuff that requires oil resources.

Now reducing coal-fired plants is something that has been working rather well. Except I seem to remember back a bit when I did that hardcore homework on all this the mainland China folks were still really big on using coal. In 2011 we went back to a fair bit of coal use here in Japan to get power back out to a greedy population. Well, I was greedy, too. We all are, when we get all comfy using power. Well, many are. I guess some folks stop using power to do the right thing. I got medically grounded about 30 years ago, so I did the right thing by no longer flying those aircraft and putting so much dirty stuff in the air. You should watch twin J79 engines start up. Now that is pollution.

 

[jtr1962]

When the vocabulary "clean" is used in relation to energy I have to ask whether the individual that wishes to be honest about using the word "clean" --- as in where the special raw material is coming from to make all that fancy "clean" energy stuff --- is that aspect of the overall picture included in that determination a given tool/product is clean?

Clean means when it's making energy it's not emitting pollution. Of course there's an energy cost to make anything, be it wind turbines, solar panels, batteries, EVs, etc. Overall though these things are far cleaner than burning fossil fuels.

Then there is the question that arises when a given electric piece of equipment was identified as "clean" is finished. You know, no good. How "clean" is 'getting rid' of that piece of equipment?

It's always better to repair than replace if possible. Things should be designed for that, and designed with a long lifetime.

I also wonder if folks truly understand how much of the fossil fuels are not used for fuel, but are used to manufacture so many, many everyday products we use. Even cosmetics and food things.

That's a separate thing from burning them, and it's arguably not wasteful if you're turning fossil fuels into something else.

Get wars stopped and you'll be doing some great clean/green stuff for the planet. Help create a planet where humans don't need all those fighter jets and tanks and APCs and more and more of all those other military support vehicles and you'll be doing some great clean/green actions to achieve some good.

True. Also stop polluting so people don't get sick and you're being greener. Hospitals use enormous amounts of energy and resources.

 

[jtr1962]

Do you mind if I toss out the political thought process and ask a question? How many of those folks that are so heavy-duty-cool at making speeches about "clean" and "green" have ditched having a personal vehicle? How many of those super high profile folks that are supposed to have influence on the average citizen have two private vehicles? How many of them fly on special charter flights? Or have their own aircraft?

To be fair most average people in the US can't ditch a personal vehicle because of development patterns and lack of public transit. Suburbia was arguably the biggest, most costly mistake of the 20th century which will take decades to fix. Of course these high profile people should ditch the private aircraft if they want to have any credibility. Same thing with the huge mansions.

To be fair China and India are making a huge mistake of their own. China built out high-speed rail and subways at an unprecedented pace. It could have avoided building highways and bypassed the automotive age entirely. Despite what you said, when a country gets richer that doesn't imply they need to have cars. Mobility can just as easily be provided by a comprehensive rail system, as it was in the US before automobiles. The newly found wealth of these countries can instead be put into better housing, or more gadgets, or even just more leisure time and earlier retirement. You don't need to keep buying stuff once you have enough. Cars especially are wasteful on so many levels. Any country which can bypass the automotive age should do so. All they need to do is look at the problems automobiles caused in the US and Europe. Arguably they created more problems than they fixed,. When too many people own automobiles, any advantage of speed or convenience vanishes. You're stuck in traffic jams and can't find parking.

As I think I wrote in another thread, we average folks can kick butt on ANY issue, if we do it correctly. To heck with those political high profile folks. You want to get something done, then DO IT!

This is a problem which needs to be fixed by those in charge. Development patterns don't change by themselves. We don't get trains by wishing for them. This country is way behind in these areas.

 

[ArAfGo]

jtr1962, you covered a lot of ground in your thoughtful responses, but I would like to ask what you think folks that live outside of urban areas should do for transportation? The kind of areas where local bus transportation isn't commercially viable?

Now we can't suddenly un-invent the automobile, so they might feel they deserve to have an automobile. Let's say you agree and so you make a law that allows certain groups of folks to have those personal automobiles. You reckon that some city folks might feel sort of cheated? Them country folks can have a car, but not me.

AND, where are the studies on how many extra city vehicles will be needed for ambulances, if you make a law doing away with personal vehicles in a given city area? What sort of new regulations would be in place on what exactly constitutes a need to call for an ambulance?

For example, I break a finger. Normally I would jump in the car and drive to the hospital. But a new city law took that auto away from me, so do I call an ambulance? Say the trains/buses are not running --- say, it is 2300hrs --- well, I could get in a lot of trouble when an ambulance crew shows up and ... wait, the operator would have asked and said "No can do." for a broken finger.

You, jtr1962, might now state that your job doesn't ask you to make decisions like I am asking about here, and that is fine. But who should be asked to make such decisions? You wrote something about "those in charge" and that is fine, but how do you want "those in charge" to get "in charge"? Via the ballot box? Appointments? I sort of thought in a democratic style nation it is us that choose those in charge? If so, isn't that the way WE get things done?

 

[Santilli]

New keyboard build. Nuphy 96 V2.Replaced Nuphy Lemons with Kailhi Box Navy 90 pcs.
The caps are from Nuphy. Love em. They are big light gets through them. This is a couple steps down from max.
Local shop wanted 230. To switch out the switches. Did it myself. Did bend a few pins. Lemons are darn good, too.

 

[Santilli]

Nuphy 96 V2 is, I think, WAY over priced at 224.00. The caps it comes with you cant get light through, and the switches are very cheap, but, they feel good.

 

[sedrosken]

That is remarkably overpriced. My K4 Pro was only something like 90 bucks with its stock switches and caps, and even with my Navies and custom DSA caps it only works out to approx $200 US. Swapping switches on a hotswap PCB like mine is annoying and time consuming, but very doable -- I bent pins on a small handful of switches, but they worked on straightening them out.

 

[Santilli]

I think it is overpriced, but I don't know an alternative to the Canopus Shine throughs. I LOVE the caps. For old people with bad sight, it's unbeatable, at least I haven't found anything yet. My RM/fiance has a cheap keyboard, and I'm going to get her a keyboard with the caps, and lighter switches.
The more I type on this keyboard, the more I like the Box Navies. That said, it's hard to tell the lemons from the Navies. I think I bent 5 pins beyond repair on the switches, so those keys are lemons, and I don't notice any difference.
While the box navies may seem a bit heavy, the accuracy when I type is about 99.9%, and I REALLY like that.

 

[Santilli]

Anyone have an alternative to Canopus Shine throughs by Nuphy?
Require huge letters, and they must allow RGB light through the bottom of the caps.

 

[Santilli]

Nuphy 96 V2, with Canopus Shine throughs

 

[Santilli]

Keyboards.: Nuphy 96 V2 with see throughs.
Also New model M, with suck control key
ordered another Nuphy 96 V2 with see throughs, and mints for GF/RM