You won't be able to drive them at 4 ohms if you're considering the TX-SR608. It's rated to support 6 to 16 ohm speakers. Anything lower may likely over-heat or possibly damage the internal amp (or it may just simply turn off).
Audio Equipment
- Thread starter ddrueding
- Start date
Stereodude
Not really a
That setting reduces the rail voltage of the amplifiers which in turn reduces the power (and current) the speaker can get which taxes the amplifier less.
What is everyone's thoughts on DIY speaker cables? I was looking to get some 10 gauge oxygen-free copper speaker wire (nothing exotic) and some GLS banana ends.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
I use my brother's stupid-expensive hand-me-downs, but I've never been able to tell the difference between those and cables and connectors I've purchased at Home Depot.
Stereodude
Not really a
Unless you have really long runs (like >50'), you don't need 10ga wire. This + this should cover you.
You don't have to solder them either. The wire will go through the back, and fold it over the screw end slightly and tighten it down. Instructions (PDF)
I actually was considering the 12ga from monoprice that you linked to. I found a thread on avs on making your own cables and the person there used the same setup that you've suggested (with a few other cosmetic things I don't care about). After reading the feedback on the monoprice banana plugs in that thread, the consensus seemed to be they were not that great, so someone linked to the GLS plugs which looked decent for the money.
I'm planning to bi-amp the L and R at a 5' run for each with and a single 5' for the center channel. If you think 12ga is enough, I won't bother with the 10ga and I can get by with spending about $45 if I use the GLS ends and 50' 12ga monoprice wire.
I'm planning to bi-amp the L and R at a 5' run for each with and a single 5' for the center channel. If you think 12ga is enough, I won't bother with the 10ga and I can get by with spending about $45 if I use the GLS ends and 50' 12ga monoprice wire.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
I don't remember what I have any more in my living room or bedroom but as I recall they're palladium and teflon and the banana plugs are gold. Probably $100 or $150/foot. Maybe more than that. It's retarded audiophile stuff.
ddrueding
Fixture
So that is what is required, no? The TX-NR708 is only $550 @ Newegg right now. In the cart as we speak.
I never dove into reviews of that receiver only because the jump in price wasn't warranted to me given the extra features it offers and also based on my needs. Although, now I kinda wish I did go for it to get the preamp outputs. When I originally bought the sr608, I didn't think I'd go for fancy speakers. Now that I have, I could probably use a cleaner amp. You'll also gain an analog to 1080P upscaling if you fancy that kind of feature for your Wii. You'll also get the Audyssey MultEQ vs the 2EQ.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
I just wish I had a receiver that supported HDMI.
Stereodude
Not really a
Yeah, that is what's needed to safely drive 4 ohm speakers with a modern receiver.
Actually, the trick is to leave the switch to 8 ohms and use the speakers. If the receiver shuts down due to excessive current or thermal shutdown, you flip the switch and that problem should go away but it'll generate / put out less power.
I had the same wish, which is why I went with the SR608.
Stereodude
Not really a
I've got 'em and they work fine for me.
I'd suggest you get cables a few feet longer than you need. Then if you move things around you don't suddenly find yourself with cables too short. Also, if you're measuring with a tape measure you'll have a tendency to underestimate the amount of cable you need in the first place.
Stereodude
Not really a
FYI: Never buy a product that has the word "magic" in the name if it costs more than ~$5. :cheers:
Stereodude
Not really a
What's stopping you? Receivers with HDMI switching have been around for years.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
The nine year old $2000 Integra Receiver I have that works just fine.
Stereodude
Not really a
I had a very nice Sony ES receiver that worked just fine too, but I got over it and bought a HDMI equipped Pioneer Elite anyhow, which in turn got replaced by another HDMI equipped Pioneer Elite.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
At some point I'll replace my main receiver but it's lower on my priorities list than paying for all the blank LTO4 tapes I have to buy.
ddrueding
Fixture
Sold out. Crap.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
Amazon will ship it for free, though.
Not always. I bought mine from newegg with free shipping. Sometimes those Onkyos come through the resellers through amazon and don't offer free shipping. I had the 608 in my amazon cart for about a month before I decided and it switch between numerous resellers and also Amazon...eventually the day I decided to buy, it was out of stock, so newegg got the win.
ddrueding
Fixture
Grrr. Back in stock with free shipping for about 30 minutes. Not long enough. 
I think I've made a wrong choice with my SR608 and I'm considering returning it. Has anyone used any of the Emotiva audio equipment? or know of any problems/concerns with their products, support, etc? The forum feedback seems well-regarded and the performance of the products seem nice for what they cost. They seem like solid A/B amplifiers and their one processor unit seems to be feature rich.
I was considering moving to the XPA-3, 3-channel amp (200W x 3) to go along with their UMC-1 Audo/Video processor. That will get me to my 3.1 setup which I plan to use for a while and then eventually I can add on an additional amplifiers for the rear channels when needed. I was thinking one additional UPA-2 125W 2-channel amp to bring me to 5.1. Later I can add another UPA-2 if I want to get to 7.1.
I was considering moving to the XPA-3, 3-channel amp (200W x 3) to go along with their UMC-1 Audo/Video processor. That will get me to my 3.1 setup which I plan to use for a while and then eventually I can add on an additional amplifiers for the rear channels when needed. I was thinking one additional UPA-2 125W 2-channel amp to bring me to 5.1. Later I can add another UPA-2 if I want to get to 7.1.
ddrueding
Fixture
What is your concern?
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
The preamp is basically just going to make the speakers you're using it with louder. That's cool and everything but I'm not sure it's needed with a decent receiver.
My concern is that the SR608 won't be strong enough to get the most out of the speakers I bought. It claims 100W per channel, but I doubt that would be sustained among all channels. I suspect it's likely a split power so in actuality the rating on Onkyo's website shows 100W x 2 channel when they rate it. Therefore it might be something along the lines of 200W / 3 channels equaling about 67W for each of my three channels I plan to drive right now.
Had I planned better, I should have at least gone with the SR708 which has preamp outputs in case I needed future amplification. The CM9s I bought have an efficiency of 89dB and recommend 30-200W @ 8ohm. If I ever drive 5 speakers down the road, it'll be about 40W per channel roughly speaking.
It's not the receiver I'm worried about, it's the amplifier power and capabilities. If this SR608 had preamp outs, I'd just consider getting an amp for the speakers. Since it can't, I was thinking of returning it and finding the components which do both.
Had I planned better, I should have at least gone with the SR708 which has preamp outputs in case I needed future amplification. The CM9s I bought have an efficiency of 89dB and recommend 30-200W @ 8ohm. If I ever drive 5 speakers down the road, it'll be about 40W per channel roughly speaking.
It's not the receiver I'm worried about, it's the amplifier power and capabilities. If this SR608 had preamp outs, I'd just consider getting an amp for the speakers. Since it can't, I was thinking of returning it and finding the components which do both.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
Handy, I have fantastically expensive speakers. Speakers that cost more than my car. They're REALLY nice. And my receiver can make them louder than I could ever hope to play them. I'm not my brother the audiophile nutball, but I'd say that if your aim was to get better sound, you'd be better off looking at the acoustics of your listening environment rather than just making your speakers louder to cover up whatever deficiencies exist in that environment.
Pradeep
Storage? I am Storage!
89dB efficiency isn't terribly low, I would try it with your speakers before upgrading. Chances are it will drive them louder that your neighbours can stand.
Is every watt of power from every amplifier going to produce the same quality at the same output of wattage?
My goal is not to get louder speakers just for the sake of going louder. I'm looking to control the speaker more accurately with a stronger amplifier that can deal with the subtle highs and lows in the dynamics of the audio. I may be thinking of this the wrong way, but if my normal listening volume is now driving the amp closer to its peak (or actually at its peak) then it may not be as clean of sound than say if a stronger amplifier is only using say 50% of its capabilities. Does that thought have any merit with regards to audio amplifiers?
I am planning to try the speakers with the SR608 before I do anything. I just started thinking about this and was wondering if I'm short-changing the capabilities of the speakers I bought by not driving them with a better amplifier. I certainly agree that adjusting the listening environment is ideal, which is part of the reason why I'm not focusing on adding rear channels yet, the room doesn't fit them easily. There isn't much else I can do with this setup unless if I move to a new house.
My goal is not to get louder speakers just for the sake of going louder. I'm looking to control the speaker more accurately with a stronger amplifier that can deal with the subtle highs and lows in the dynamics of the audio. I may be thinking of this the wrong way, but if my normal listening volume is now driving the amp closer to its peak (or actually at its peak) then it may not be as clean of sound than say if a stronger amplifier is only using say 50% of its capabilities. Does that thought have any merit with regards to audio amplifiers?
I am planning to try the speakers with the SR608 before I do anything. I just started thinking about this and was wondering if I'm short-changing the capabilities of the speakers I bought by not driving them with a better amplifier. I certainly agree that adjusting the listening environment is ideal, which is part of the reason why I'm not focusing on adding rear channels yet, the room doesn't fit them easily. There isn't much else I can do with this setup unless if I move to a new house.
Pradeep
Storage? I am Storage!
The "best" power tends to come from amps running in Class A mode. Downsides are very high power consumption and heat generation. I don't think any receivers use it.
Damping factor can effect the tightness of the bass.
Personally I've had the best sound from a hybrid power amp with a tube input stage.
Having pre-outs for all channels does allow you a measure of future proofing, basically the receiver turns into a pre-amp.
Damping factor can effect the tightness of the bass.
Personally I've had the best sound from a hybrid power amp with a tube input stage.
Having pre-outs for all channels does allow you a measure of future proofing, basically the receiver turns into a pre-amp.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
Most of the fine tuning I've had to do in relation to volume control was as simple as bumping the volume for my center channel.
Pradeep
Storage? I am Storage!
The danger to speakers comes from overdriving of the amp, and the resulting distortion reaching the drivers. From a tech perpective it's better to drive with more power than needed, rather that too little.
I don't think any other receiver uses a strict A either, they're also very heavy because of the larger components required to cool and supply power. The amplifiers made by Emotiva that I inquired about claim to be a Class A/B which tries to offset the power consumption problem of a strict Class A like you described but also works towards having good sound.
The odd thing though is you mention having pre-outs is a measure of future-proofing, but the general impression I'm feeling is that going with a dedicated amp shouldn't ever be needed. I was aware the SR608 didn't have pre-outs when I bought it and at the time I didn't care because I wasn't originally going down the road of new speakers...but I changed plans and now I'm re-assessing if going with a separate amplifier solution is better.
Tuning sure, but do you think it's possible with a better amplifier that your fantastically expensive speakers could sound even more fantastic at the same volume level?
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
It's possible, but I don't think the marginal improvement is worth the investment. Chasing the last 1% that stands between what I have and some magnificent audio perfection is what distinguishes my brother from me. I have a great setup (less the HDMI I know I don't have, but my stuff is ripped anyway) and I know it.