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LunarMist

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Another question - how many drives to buy. Do you all buy extra drives for future replacement? I was thinking that it would be prudent to get 6 drives first to see if the whole thing works out and then maybe get another three to have an unused spare. My concern is that the exact drive model will be discontinued at some point. Are the NAS sensitive to different drives (assuming same capacity and general speed) or was that problem resolved years ago? Thanks.
 

Stereodude

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Are the NAS sensitive to different drives (assuming same capacity and general speed) or was that problem resolved years ago? Thanks.
Mixing different drives is bound to have some impact. It may not be noticeable though. A newer drive is also likely to be faster, so it's probably not going to slow down the NAS.
 
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I prefer to keep the same drives in a unit (first round is all bought at the same time), but many have ended up with mixed drives (some even different capacities). I've never had any issue or measurable performance impact.
 

LunarMist

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Before I pull the trigger, does everyone like the Hitachi NAS drive? Another option would be the WD RED, but I'm not sure how reliable they are. At 5400 RPM I suspect they would be a lot quieter.
 

Handruin

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Thanks. Are all the 12 HGST NAS drives noticeably noisy?
I can only speak for the 4TB HGST NAS drives and to me they are fairly quiet. If my NAS is busy with IO I can hear the grumble of seeks that are happening but I don't hear the spin/whine from the drive.
 

Mercutio

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The Hitachi 4TB drives are distinctly louder than the Seagates but absent a solid basis for comparison, you'd never be able to tell. None of them are anything like the old 10k drives.
 

Handruin

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The Hitachi 4TB drives are distinctly louder than the Seagates but absent a solid basis for comparison, you'd never be able to tell. None of them are anything like the old 10k drives.
I've found the inverse to be true when comparing my 4TB HGST to my 3TB Seagate both in the same case in my desktop. I can heard I/O to the Seagate but can't to the HGST.
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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They each have distinct noise floors, but the 4k7000s are definitely louder. Review sites I checked say they're all between 30 and 35dB with WD on the lower end and Hitachi on the upper. It may be a case where one noise is subjectively less agreeable than another (we had a similar disagreement over the acceptability of the CoolerMaster Hyper 212, I think).
 

Handruin

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They each have distinct noise floors, but the 4k7000s are definitely louder. Review sites I checked say they're all between 30 and 35dB with WD on the lower end and Hitachi on the upper. It may be a case where one noise is subjectively less agreeable than another (we had a similar disagreement over the acceptability of the CoolerMaster Hyper 212, I think).
It could also just be my ears are less susceptible (or more) to a range of sounds vs the others or maybe my case is better at silencing a certain range of sounds. The reality of answering Lunar about this topic is subjective from both of us. Only actual test measurements can be useful and even then it'll depend on his case or environment. When I put my system into its silent mode (stops all fans including GPUs) I can hear the Seagate drive seek whereas I can't on the HGST (when driving I/O). I don't detect whine from either drive given where my case is but I know they both make noise when the side panel is open and my ear is near them.
 
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One of the wonderful things about a NAS is that your storage can live elsewhere. I keep mine in the garage. It is fairly quiet until I start hitting it hard, then the grinding sound is noticeable.
 

LunarMist

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This would only be about 6-8 feet away from me. Some drive in my main computer is making clunking/grinding sounds every 15 seconds, which is louder in the new case. I'm not sure if it is the 6TB Hitachi NAS or Seagates, but the former is more likely.
 

Handruin

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For those that are building your own NAS, are you aware of this little motherboard from ASRock? ( http://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=E3C224D4I-14S#Specifications )

Extended mini-ITX
Socket 1150, i3/i5/i7/Xeon E3
upto 32GB DDR3 RAM
LSI 2308 controller + Intel C224 southbridge. (Up to 12 drives).
Dual LAN.
IPMI via AST controller...
Spec-wise it's very very similar to my supermicro MBD-X10SL7-F-O that runs my current nas.

http://m.newegg.com/Product/index?itemnumber=N82E16813182821
 

Chewy509

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LiamC

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I was researching the idea of buying all the same drive recently (zfs) and the consensus was that this a bad idea as:
* Recent failure analysis seems to point to localised failures in HDD - i.e. some drives in a particular batch may be more error prone that the failure rates in a drive family. Obviously if you get get a bad batch you can hose your entire NAS
* HDD geometries are similar enough these days for mix-n-match arrays to have little performance downsides. You also negate or reduce the likelyhood of the above failure point. The caveat is that some manufacturers cripple consumer level firmware, or make trade-offs, that don't make them good candidates for arrays.
* You cannot mix 512 byte and 4K byte sector drives without performance impacts. A corner case is that I have a mirrored zfs pool with two 512 byte sector drives in one mirror and two 4K sector drives in the other mirror. Both mirrors form a pool without any noticeable performance issue.
 

Mercutio

Fatwah on Western Digital
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There are two conflicting bits of conventional wisdom. One is that you want different sorts of drives to prevent manufacturing or firmware defects from hosing an array. The other, which stems back to the days of EXTREMELY picky hardware controllers, is that if there's even a slight size/geometry mismatch between drives, an array won't reinitialize on a replacement drive.

I had the latter problem on late 90s era hardware and I'm fairly certain I've seen Microsoft recommendations for identical drives even in Server 2012 documentation, though software RAID tends to be MUCH more tolerant of small drive differences than 20 year old SCSI controllers.
 

LiamC

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Just an observation. I was using an Athlon X2 260 on an Asrock MATX 780 something board and this setup would lose a disk connected to a highpoint controller weekly. Occasional errors fixed by a resilver as well.

I changed the board over to a P67 + i5 2400 and there has only been one dropout in more than a year.

And hello all
 
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Of course something interesting arrives 2 days after I place an order.

Synology DS1817+
16GB RAM Kit
4x X540-T2 10Gb NICs
6x 10TB ST10000VN0004
2x Samsung 850 Pro
1x Netgear 16-port 10Gb switch

Won't even arrive until tomorrow.
 

LunarMist

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The new QNAP TS-1277 1600-16G almost has Mooner's name printed on it. It has been designed to answer his needs.

2299$, so it's not that expensive for what it is.
It might be a good choice, but the 8+4 configuration is not ideal for larger NAS. The 6+2 bay is far too small for the price.
I suppose there is a trend toward the SSD cache, but does both read and write use RAID 1 (4 SSD)? I question the reliability of that.
 

LunarMist

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Of course something interesting arrives 2 days after I place an order.

Synology DS1817+
16GB RAM Kit
4x X540-T2 10Gb NICs
6x 10TB ST10000VN0004
2x Samsung 850 Pro
1x Netgear 16-port 10Gb switch

Won't even arrive until tomorrow.
I wonder how noisy that switch is. I could not find any that were not 1U and unusable for the home environment.
 

Clocker

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If you have a 10 GbE swtich, connected to a gigabit router directing traffic, will the computers that area connected to the switch be able to talk to each other at 10 GbE speeds as long as they have 10 GbE adapter cards and are connected with Cat-6 cabling?
 

Handruin

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If you have a 10 GbE swtich, connected to a gigabit router directing traffic, will the computers that area connected to the switch be able to talk to each other at 10 GbE speeds as long as they have 10 GbE adapter cards and are connected with Cat-6 cabling?
In short, yes. The systems connected to that switch that do not need their traffic routed outside of the local switch should all communicated at 10Gb.

I should add, this is exactly how my home network is configured except that I'm using a 1Gb switch. One of the ports on the 1Gb switch is connected to my router. All traffic within my house uses up to 1Gb.
 

LunarMist

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Of course something interesting arrives 2 days after I place an order.

Synology DS1817+
16GB RAM Kit
4x X540-T2 10Gb NICs
6x 10TB ST10000VN0004
2x Samsung 850 Pro
1x Netgear 16-port 10Gb switch

Won't even arrive until tomorrow.
The https://www.synology.com/en-global/products/performance#5_10bayDS1817 was recently announced and has 10GbE with higher STR than the + for some reason. The DS1817 uses the Armada CPU, so maybe there are less IOPs.
 

Handruin

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I haven't seen anything on 2.5 and 5G switches. I keep a loose eye on 10Gb hardware as it's more commonplace than 2.5/5G.
 
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If you have a 10 GbE swtich, connected to a gigabit router directing traffic, will the computers that area connected to the switch be able to talk to each other at 10 GbE speeds as long as they have 10 GbE adapter cards and are connected with Cat-6 cabling?
My inital config won't include a switch at all. The 10GbE card in the computer and the NAS will each have two ports. One of each will to go the normal 1GbE switch. The other will connect the two directly. These will have IPs in a different range. You may need to change the interface metric to get them to prioritize the faster link.
 
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