Eggxpert Tiered Power Supply List

[Handruin]

This is a decent list from the Eggxpert Tiered Power Supply List thread. It has and decent breakdown of power supplies to select from. I'm sure some may disagree though.

 

[Mercutio]

I'd move the HEC Orion up a notch and I think I'd put all the Fotron/FSP group power supplies down on the bottom, at the very least. But yeah, that's a decent summary.

 

[CougTek]

During the last four years, I must have sold between 150 and 200 In Win enclosures with an included 350W powersupply. The model they provide with the case changed last year. I have yet to have a single return on these.

Last year, I've started to sell Sparkle SPI350ACA8 power supplies. Certified 80Plus Bronze, they cost me less than 40$. I probably sold ~50 of those so far. Once again, not a single return.

Yet, they placed those two brands in the "to avoid" category. So take this list VERY lightly. It doesn't seem to have been made by people who sell a significant volume of components. I certainly don't have anywhere near the volume that NewEgg has, but with over 200 sales with the concerned components, I definetly have more than an average Joe picture of what's reliable and what isn't.

 

[time]

IMO, there's much better information to be had in this FAQ by Makalu at Guru 3D. He also has the only reviews I can find for the Antec Earthwatts D Green series and the Antec Neo Eco series.

Here's a map of PSU reviews by other people with load testers and oscilloscopes.

Also from Makalu is this list of maximum combined 12V ratings for PSUs that also includes who made them. And here's another list of who makes what.

Finally, an excellent list of PC power requirements.

 

[Mercutio]

Where are you finding these links? I've got a dozen or so tech sites that I track with Google Reader and I haven't seen anything like this or the Failure rates links you posted anywhere else but through your posts.

 

[Bozo]

Good Stuff!!! :-D

 

[time]

I'm continuing a topic from another thread here because it's more relevant.

Time, the computers I build go into an industrial enviorment; dirt, dirt, and more dirt. Also, because we convert AC to DC (and in some cases back to AC) all the SCR switching and power factors that approach 20%, our computers take a beating. We also pump DC back into the AC line through SCRs when the DC motors 're-gen'. A 'scope trace on our 120v line looks like a wooly worm (hairy catapiller). I have used nothing but Antec power supplies for 10 years now with great success. I have had a few fail, but it is usually after they have been running 24/7/365 for 5-6 years, mostly failing because of the dirt.
And, 95% are not on a UPS.
My hardware failures for this year so far are: 5 Supermicro motherboards, 1 power supply - Antec, and 2 hard drives - Seagate.

Thanks Bozo, that's more what I'm after - except that Antec has several different models made by three different manufacturers. According to the return stats, their most reliable model is the 400W Basiq that's made by FSP. The 650W Earthwatts is from Delta and was (relatively) the least reliable of their bulk sellers. I don't understand why the more common 380 and 430W Earthwatts aren't in the list; either they don't sell in Europe or none fail?

The Neo 400 reported must be a Neo Eco, which is a cousin of the original Seasonic Earthwatts. We know it did well - in the first 6-12 months of its life anyway!

Any idea what your current crop of Antecs is made up of?

I have been using 350W to 650W 80+ power supplies for the last 3-4 years. I keep three spares in stock now. 2-MT350 (or MT352) for the minuete cases, and 3 or 4 Earthwatts 430w and 1 Earthwatts 650W. This covers everything I have installed. ~175 computers.
Also, 99% of my cases are Antec, so a lot of them came with power supplies. Mostly the 380W versions.
But:
The early Minuete cases with the MT300 and the early MT350 power supplies had a lot of failures.
I had an Antec power supply (I don't remember the number, but it had removable cables) that wouldn't work with some Intel motherboards.
Nothings perfect. I bought 15 Supermicro motherbooards and 5 died within 6 months.
I am now replacing some older Intel motherboards with swollen capacitors. I have 33 Intel D915GEV motherboards in the plant that die without warning, and the capacitors look fine.
And, I had one Antec power supply that was dead out of the box.
In the last three years the failure rate on most computer parts has dropped. Probably because of the better capacitors, in the better equipment.

 

[Tannin]

During the last four years, I must have sold between 150 and 200 In Win enclosures with an included 350W powersupply. The model they provide with the case changed last year. I have yet to have a single return on these.

Last year, I've started to sell Sparkle SPI350ACA8 power supplies. Certified 80Plus Bronze, they cost me less than 40$. I probably sold ~50 of those so far. Once again, not a single return.

Yet, they placed those two brands in the "to avoid" category. So take this list VERY lightly. It doesn't seem to have been made by people who sell a significant volume of components. I certainly don't have anywhere near the volume that NewEgg has, but with over 200 sales with the concerned components, I definetly have more than an average Joe picture of what's reliable and what isn't.

Absolutely right.

FSP make excellent power supplies. I've sold hundreds of them over the years, and provided that I select a PSU appropriate to the task, FSPs are as reliable as any brand, and better than most. We usually sell three PSUs as aftermarket parts (i.e., in addition to whatever comes in our cases):

(1) a cheap one for small jobs - repairing a small, old computer that isn't worth spending a lot of money on, for example. Can be any brand and you never know who actually makes these, I just try a few till I find one that goes OK and then stick to it until further notice.

(2) a good standard mid-range PSU suitable for most jobs. Must be reliable and have enough oomph to deal with all standard systems. FSP is the best brand around for this.

(3) a serious monster PSU, mostly just for gaming, nothing else needs that much power these days. Mostly I use Amacrox but there are others.

 

[Tannin]

Oh: my FSP return count - one or zero, not sure. More than satisfactory, certainly.

The cheap things fall over sometimes, but I don't bother returning them, just throw them away.

 

[time]

This is my analysis of the actual OEM manufacturers, based on multiple PSU reviews:

Seasonic has very good designs but inconsistent manufacturing quality. They used to provide Antec's Earthwatts series, and now they make Antec's Neo (Eco) series, which apparently is the same basic design in a different layout (eg. 120mm intake fan instead of 80mm exhaust fan).

FSP is much bigger and probably sells 10 times the number of units, and they vary from rubbish to excellent. They make certain Antec Basiq models which are low efficiency but very reliable - during the warranty period at least. Some of their 80Plus offerings are the best you can get at certain price points, but some are still unreliable and their cheaper products are poor - which you'd expect because they're so cheap, I guess.

Delta is a huge company (although it's unclear how prominent they are in the ATX PSU market). Their manufacturing quality is second to none, but what for them is a budget design - the current Antec Earthwatts - delivers marginal compliance with the relevant standards. In particular, ripple is often close to or exceeds the defined limits. Obviously this doesn't apply to their more up-market designs, such as the Antec Signature.

So Antec Earthwatts has actually been 2 completely different designs from different manufacturers with variants on each. The latest 'Green' model is a variant on the original Delta Earthwatts D series from a couple of years ago. On the face of it, it appears to sacrifice stability for efficiency.

It would appear that Seasonic was not able to make their design efficient enough for the price that Antec wanted for inclusion with their cases. And Delta does appear to have flawless manufacturing capabilities; switching to them may well have reduced Antec's return rate, and that would matter more on the lower margin of a case + PSU bundle. But Antec has hedged their bets by also selling the revised Seasonic as the Neo Eco, which in some markets has modular cables.

For me, the choice is Earthwatts D Green vs Neo Eco: excellent manufacturing of a substandard design with average component quality vs inconsistent manufacturing of a superior design with very slightly better components. Another factor is that the Neo Eco is physically longer than the ATX standard (by 10mm).

Or, I can pay another $20-30 and get the Seasonic Sii Bronze, which upgrades the components and raises efficiency.

If a PSU is already close to power quality limits when it's new, and it uses cut-price components, what are the odds that it will still be meeting operating standards when it's 5 years old? Yeah, that's what I thought too, so I've decided on option 3.

 

[time]

I should add, that in this little exercise I want to remove the PSU as any possible cause of instability, RAM corruption or SSD death - even after 5 years. So I'm really looking for 'server quality' at a reasonable price.

In other circumstances, I'd still be happy to use the Earthwatts D 380W that comes with Antec Solution cases. But I'd give them a miss for high-powered graphics cards, etc.

 

[Tannin]

a cheap one for small jobs ...... I just try a few till I find one that goes OK and then stick to it until further notice.

That was ambiguous. What I meant was that I try a few different brands and models in the desired price range (low!) until I find one that seems to go OK. Then I stick to it for as long as it stays available or until I see too many failures, mostly the former.

It's worth mentioning that FSP are well known for making PSUs for the major OEMs - Compaq for example, but many others. Curiously enough, this is a recommendation for FSP, not a mark against the company. The major OEMs don't give a damn about performance (their customers know nothing about computers and Compaq know that because these very same people bought a Compaq) but they do care about the cost of warranty service. Compaq will always take a slower hard drive if it's $0.20c cheaper (remember the Bigfoot?) or a low-performance chipset if it saves a dollar, but they try pretty hard not to stack up servicing costs - so their power supplies, while always just barely, marginally, slightly, microscopically big enough to power the system, will indeed power that system, in most cases, for a good long time. (Just don't bother adding a part that uses more power, such as a bigger graphics card.) IBM used FSP power supplies in their desktop systems for years. So did HP, Packard-Bell, and so on. Always, the pattern was the same: a tiny, under-specced PSU which was nevertheless remarkably reliable at the design load - and not a penny over it.

Most systems I see these days are easy-peasy: on-board graphics, dual core CPU, single HDD, single optical drive. that's it. Fitting an FSP PSU to one of those is probably overkill, but they are not expensive, so why not?

 

[time]

Although I have someone on Ignore (it's mutual), I just peeked to see if he had decided to stop being an arse.

I used a lowish cost FSP (not 80Plus) recently to fix a 4-year-old computer, recognizing that it only had to last a year or two, and with reasonable confidence that it won't destroy the rest of the PC if it does fail.

What I would NEVER do is use the cheapest PSU of unknown origin that I could buy. As someone with experience and knowledge of what can happen, I'd be negligent to do so. Especially when you can get a decent one as I described (or an Antec Basiq, etc) for $35. Less in the US of course; at NewEgg that will buy you a Seasonic 300W 80Plus Bronze (or it did until they raised the price $4).

 

[Mercutio]

I'm not sure where you guys are getting love for FSP power supplies. I seem to toss them pretty regularly. They're not PSUs that I buy, just the ones that happen to be in machines that I service. I see them in lots of OEM machines. And then I take them out and replace them with whatever I've purchased most recently purchased to use for replacement power supplies.

Which is often an Antec Basiq but at other times might be a Rosewill (Newegg's store brand), HEC or Sparkle PSU, depending what I can get for around $35.

 

[Bozo]

Reading this post is most interesting. But I was wondering if the failures could be broke down into 'failures per 100 bought/sold' or something. Does anyone keep those types of records?

 

[time]

I actually avoided those super-low-end HEC models; you know, where they can't even afford a fan grill so airflow's about a third of what it should be.

And I try not to support predatory anti-competitive behavior, so I don't think Rosewill would be on my list. But sooner or later, it will be crap anyway - isn't that the ultimate aim in vertical integration?

As for Sparkle and Antec Basiq, they're genuine Fortron Source (FSP) products - in fact, Sparkle is actually part of the FSP Group.

So I'm glad you like them.

 

[time]

Does anyone keep those types of records?

Dell and HP probably do, but only for the duration of their nominal warranty. So if it's a choice between a PSU that costs $30 and lasts 3 years, versus a PSU that costs $20 but lasts 13 months, which do you think will get the nod?

I'm exaggerating for levity, but that's the basic principle.

 

[Buck]

I'm not sure where you guys are getting love for FSP power supplies. I seem to toss them pretty regularly. They're not PSUs that I buy, just the ones that happen to be in machines that I service. I see them in lots of OEM machines. And then I take them out and replace them with whatever I've purchased most recently purchased to use for replacement power supplies.

I wonder if the difference in experience comes from the regional difference in electrical systems.

 

[Tannin]

This is the one I use, Merc: http://www.anyware.com.au/PS-RK500.aspx

I suppose I've gone through close to a hundred now, bit less than that at a guess, and I don't have a record of the failure count but .... one? none? I'm pretty sure that there was one crook one out of the whole lot.

Of my current cheapie brand (couldn't tell you what it is, don't care really so long as they work) I've not had any failures out of (I think) 40-odd units. I don't really expect them to survive real nastiness coming down the AC line, but then I don't expect a $200 PSU to survive the shit that our newly-privatised power companies inflict on us either.

What usually happens with cheapies (not just power supplies, cheapie everything) is that they get established in the market and work really well for a while, then, one day, they decide to cut production costs and drop the quality. All of a sudden, your once-trustworthy product is a can of worms. The trick is to know when to switch brands. You get that first batch you are not happy with - switch right away.

They don't always do this, of course, but it's something to watch out for. You see it with PSUs, monitors, RAM, cases, all sorts of things.

So why not just use something better in the first place? (Like the FSPs, for example.) It's a matter of balance: for a quality system or one that needs to be high-availability (a point-of-sale system, for example), you spend the money. I never use cheap power supplies or cases in the systems I build myself - I learned not to do that nearly 20 years ago, and it's just as true now as it was then.

For repair work - and even now, semi-retired and working two days out of seven I still replace two power supplies a week on average - I generally use an FSP or similar unit (what I call "good quality plain vanilla") for anything less than about three or four years old; a big, expensive unit for special, high-power systems (which are pretty rare these days); and a cheapie for elderly stuff that isn't worth spending any proper money on. It's just not sensible to throw away perfectly good money putting a $70 power supply into a system worth, at best, $200 all up. But it is sensible to repair it with a cheap part (I'll use a second-hand PSU if I've got one) and get another couple of years worth of service out of (say) a late-model Pentium 4 or a Sempron 3100 or some such.

The real head-scratcher for me is the industry pricing structure. You have cheap ones, you have very reasonably priced middle-of-the-road ones - which can be a little smaller than you really want - and then you have shockingly expensive damn things with black paint. I mean why? Why do you go from around $60 for a nice plain PSU direct to $160 for then next size up? It just doesn't make sense. Is black paint really that dear?

 

[Mercutio]

The top-tier PSUs weigh 50% more than the middle guys. Black paint and gold trim must be very heavy.

 

[Mercutio]

I actually avoided those super-low-end HEC models; you know, where they can't even afford a fan grill so airflow's about a third of what it should be.

I'm generally not using the super-low end ones. There are some really crummy ones that are made out of solid air (much like the PSU Tannin linked to, which apparently weighs 0kg if the specs page is to be believed), and there are modest and unassuming mid-range models. HEC has a nice, reliable 350W PSU that I can sometimes get for $30 with a heft that's on par with some of the nicer mid-range PSUs we've been discussing.

As for Sparkle and Antec Basiq, they're genuine Fortron Source (FSP) products

Clearly, there's some kind of differentiation in the products. I have no idea what it is, but I can certainly tell what I'm pulling out when I'm doing a replacement.

 

[Tannin]

I forgot to mention: I used to use Sparkle PSUs back in the day, Merc. They were good. It was a while back - I think we were building Athlon Classics with them, or maybe Athlon Thunderbirds. Whatever, it was quite a while back.

 

[tazwegion]

I mean why? Why do you go from around $60 for a nice plain PSU direct to $160 for then next size up? It just doesn't make sense. Is black paint really that dear?

The top-tier PSUs weigh 50% more than the middle guys. Black paint and gold trim must be very heavy.

It's not all about the "bling factor" OR geek bragging rights, your going from "adequate" to more than "sufficient" higher tier PSU's which offer more like...

• Better thermal dissipation (bigger heavier heatsinks)
• Better PCB layout (improved component placement & airflow)
• Better quality components (not unknown variables)
• Better voltage regulation & filtering
• Active (rather than passive) power factor correction
• Better load efficiency (hence the tiered 80plus ratings)
• Better workmanship
• Better product research, development & testing
• Higher quality control standards

The generic PSU's just don't have as much presence in the higher capacity PSU market where obviously brand names, flash, reputation & popularity (brand loyalty) dominate, unfortunately these purportedly reputable companies can sometimes drop the ball (for the end user) as they outsource the PSU's manufacture to the lowest bidder resulting in bling, flash and an inadequate product with at the very best a significantly reduced service life...

 

[Tannin]

All good points, Tazwegion, but none of them answer my question.

Why is there this massive gap in the market? Sure, you go up from one model to another, but ... let's put it this way: if PSUs were meals, you'd be going from airline meal to roadhouse feed to counter meal or good, plain home cooking ..... then straight to $300 a plate haute cuisine. WTF happens in-between? There is NOTHING!

I quite often want something just as reliable as the excellent little Rock 500W units I sell (linked to earlier in this thread), but with (say) 40% more power available. Sure, I can get that ..... but at 240% of the price!

Still, at least I get free black paint and gold trim with it. I shouldn't complain.

 

[tazwegion]

All good points, Tazwegion, but none of them answer my question.

Why is there this massive gap in the market? Sure, you go up from one model to another, but ... let's put it this way: if PSUs were meals, you'd be going from airline meal to roadhouse feed to counter meal or good, plain home cooking ..... then straight to $300 a plate haute cuisine. WTF happens in-between? There is NOTHING!

I quite often want something just as reliable as the excellent little Rock 500W units I sell (linked to earlier in this thread), but with (say) 40% more power available. Sure, I can get that ..... but at 240% of the price!

Still, at least I get free black paint and gold trim with it. I shouldn't complain.

What I'm trying to convey is 700w generic PSU's do exist but they aren't as common in the market due to the fact the existing products meet (however adequately is up to conjecture) the basic PC build requirements, thus systems with higher demands (read as performance) generally fall into the custom "specialty" build segment of the market which tends to cater predominantly to the DIY enthusiast, so unless you stuffing a GTX570 into a new system you don't generally need the overhead amperage on your 12v rail(s)


One would have to concede that if demand increased then so would production & availability, another point to consider is manufacturer's recommended PSU minimum wattage and the fact that they have attempted to factor in these 700w failures that can barely compete against a decent 500w known brand PSU.


I get where you're coming from as to why there's no widely available quality (un-blinged) reliable generic PSU's about and I can only suggest that it's a matter of trial and error for the builder to locate something suitable, ultimately the producers of many of these units recognize the better markup commanded by flashy PSU's and they want in on that market segment... which by it's very nature is driven by brand loyalty, public perception (enthusiast site reviews) and appearances


Bottom line, the computer industry doesn't cater to the needs of the shop/corporate builder as they once did

 

[Tannin]

I get where you're coming from as to why there's no widely available quality (un-blinged) reliable generic PSU's about

Oh no. There is no shortage of good, reliable cheap(ish) PSUs. Sure, you have to try a few till you get a brand that does what you need, but we have pretty much never had an issue sourcing good, reliable, trustworthy PSUs for everyday use in everyday systems.

The problems start when you want a bit more than the average power output - typically because you are looking at a system with a big(ish) graphics card and/or multiple drives. Ath that point, you are suddenly paying huge dollars for bling.

I simply do not believe that I am the only person who would buy that sort of PSU. In fact, I reckon most of us here would sell them, and so would a heap of other people.

Why are manufacturers so damn stupid?

 

[time]

I quite often want something just as reliable as the excellent little Rock 500W units I sell (linked to earlier in this thread), but with (say) 40% more power available. Sure, I can get that ..... but at 240% of the price!

This post is intended to help anyone who happens to read this. I'm not singling out Tannin for a lecture - it's just a good example of how confused people are about power supplies, so please take this in the spirit in which it was intended.

The Rock 500W costs about AU$40 (excluding tax), more from some retailers. The Antec Basiq 350W is about AU$35. Both are budget units with no pretense to high efficiency, let alone 80PLUS certification.

1. Deciphering the numbers on the label
I can't imagine how you could overload the 3.3V or 5V rails of any PSU. The only rating that matters these days is the combined 12V wattage, ideally expressed as amps for clarity. In some cases, this can be 90% of the total PSU rating (all rails combined).

The Rock PS-RK500 label lists two 12V rails, each 18A. You might think that adds up to a total of 36A or 432W, but you'd be wrong. The label states that the combined 12V rails are limited to 348W. That's 29A.

2. Optimistic labeling
Just because a vendor claims that their PSU is rated at 500W doesn't mean they're telling the truth. Under test, the Rock was only able to deliver 475W, with a combined 27A from the 12V rails.

In contrast, most good quality power supplies can deliver 10-30% more than their rated capacity (indirectly due to meeting 80PLUS requirements). The Antec Basiq 350 is rated at 23A but can manage at least 26A on the 12V rails.

So you'd be entitled to ask what the difference is between these two PSUs. In reality, the Rock 500 appears to be a 380-400W PSU.

3. Design matters
Basiq is Antec's ultra-low-cost range. You're spoilt for choice in their midrange with Earthwatts, Neo Eco, True Power and High Current Gamer, all made by Delta Electronics or Seasonic. All are certified 80PLUS compliant, meaning they've been independently tested. Other brands tend to focus more on the high-end, or "bling" if you like.

The Antec Neo Eco 450 costs AU$54. It's rated to deliver 34A on the 12V rail, although tests show the range can supply 20% more than that before exceeding ATX specifications. Let's round it down to 40.5A.

40.5A is 50% more power than the 27A that the Rock managed, for 35% more money ($14). So the 450W PSU is a very significant upgrade over the 500W PSU.

In the same vein, the Antec Neo Eco 620 is sold as a 620W PSU for AU$81. But it's rated to deliver 48A on the 12V rail. Conservative ratings to meet 80PLUS mean that it could be considered a 750W PSU, with a whopping 58A.

Very, very few people truly need 48A, let alone nearly 60A. Similarly, less than one in 10,000 need a 750W PSU. But that's where the bling comes in ...

 

[tazwegion]

Oh no. There is no shortage of good, reliable cheap(ish) PSUs. Sure, you have to try a few till you get a brand that does what you need, but we have pretty much never had an issue sourcing good, reliable, trustworthy PSUs for everyday use in everyday systems.

I'm referring to your higher wattage units not the 350~500w rated items floating about.

Very, very few people truly need 48A, let alone nearly 60A. Similarly, less than one in 10,000 need a 750W PSU. But that's where the bling comes in ...

Exactly... end users can easily get swept up into thinking they need a higher wattage PSU when in fact all they really require is something capable of sustaining higher amperage on the 12v line(s) to power those beastly GPU & drive intensive installations etc.


I acquired one of those basic PSU's back in 2004 namely a Codegen 550w, it seemed okay having twin fans for improved airflow and (purported) over voltage protection etc. but it couldn't run my K8N Neo2/A64 3700+ system (following an upgrade from s462) at all which approximately required 320w~360w to operate, it simply crashed and generally behaved badly, I picked up a used Antec Trueblue480 pulled the Fuhjyyu capacitors (which had gone terminal) replacing them with SamXon low ESR capacitors and it hasn't missed a beat since (even those LEDs are okay), I expect this PSU to have sufficient overhead for my next scheduled upgrade


BTW if anyone's curious that Codegen got retro-fitted with better capacitors too and is currently powering a 2100+ Palomino system 24/7 (waste not want not)

 

[ddrueding]

IIRC, peak efficiency for a PSU is at 50% load? So my 1200W PSUs sucking 580W of juice are ideal? Good to know at least two of these things are being used where they should be.

 

[tazwegion]

IIRC, peak efficiency for a PSU is at 50% load? So my 1200W PSUs sucking 580W of juice are ideal? Good to know at least two of these things are being used where they should be.

Not exactly, newer 80plus certified PSU's need to maintain 80% efficiency (or above) during their operational range primarily 20%,50% & 100% loading states, the picture below (sourced from wikipedia but not hot linked) further demonstrates this...

The full article @ Wikipedia is a worthy read and further expands on previous references regarding misleading PSU wattage ratings

 

[time]

IIRC, peak efficiency for a PSU is at 50% load? So my 1200W PSUs sucking 580W of juice are ideal? Good to know at least two of these things are being used where they should be.

You were the 1 in 10,000 I was thinking of.

And you're slightly out, I'm pretty sure you measured that at the wall, so you're actually drawing 500W or less from the PSU, which is closer to 40% load. In practise, 80PLUS units are more efficient above 50% than below it, until you get closer to their 100% rating. Most PSUs struggle to reach the standard at the 20% mark, and things go downhill fast after that. 70% efficiency is actually very good at 10% load, and you're probably looking at 50% or even worse by the time you get to 5% load.

Tazwegion, my neighbour had a Codegen until recently. It even took out his USB HDD when it blew.

 

[Tannin]

Codegen is a really good name to know. They are very cheap and can usually be trusted


..... to fail after about 5 minutes use.

I've owned helium balloons that were heavier than the average Codegen PSU.

If you have a good one, treasure it - 'cause it's one of a kind!

 

[tazwegion]

Tazwegion, my neighbour had a Codegen until recently. It even took out his USB HDD when it blew.

I figured them for junk but not a Sociopath as well

 

[time]

I used a lowish cost FSP (not 80Plus) recently to fix a 4-year-old computer, recognizing that it only had to last a year or two, and with reasonable confidence that it won't destroy the rest of the PC if it does fail.

Here's where I eat humble pie. The user called before to tell me that it's light's out for that computer. Obviously, I suspect the FSP power supply. So in all probability, I need to defer to Mercutio's opinion. :bow:

 

[Mercutio]

In contrast, I haven't had to toss one in a few weeks so I'm feeling more inclined to be charitable.

 

[tazwegion]

Here's where I eat humble pie. The user called before to tell me that it's light's out for that computer. Obviously, I suspect the FSP power supply. So in all probability, I need to defer to Mercutio's opinion. :bow:

Oh great!... I've been contemplating a FSP-400w unit as a replacement on a current legacy re-build project it's "Tsumori PSU" doesn't inspire any confidence what so ever, I was hoping to keep the budget small

 

[time]

I've now got the PC here and tried hooking up a new power supply. A very bright white light shone from the motherboard for a few seconds. Not properly awake, I stabbed repeatedly at the front power button before coming to my senses and hitting the rocker switch on the PSU.

Too late! The magic smoke escaped.

Not sure if it was a RAM indicator LED or a diode that decided to become a power LED, ever so fleetingly. Whatever, it's just charred remains now.

Which came first, the shorted motherboard or the blown PSU? I'm still leaning towards the PSU, because as I was on the phone giving the bad news to the customer, I noticed something poking through the 120mm fan grill. It looks like an end-mounted diode, except it's just rattling around now and definitely not mounted; there's traces of solder on one of the leads. :???:

 

[tazwegion]

Sounds like "smoke testing" to me... so dare I ask what was the breed of the PSU?

 

[time]

FSP (Fortron Source). Six months old, in a home use PC.

The diode fell out so I kept it. It's a SR504 Schottky rectifier from Taiwan Semiconductor.

I'm more than happy to send you the warranty replacement unit when I get it, if that helps. :diablo:

 

[tazwegion]

Thanks but I'm looking for something that will last longer than 6 months, I guess I'll have to cough up for an entry level Antec after all